“Fairfax County, Virginia: The Dangerous Consequences of Sanctuary Policies”

1[House Hearing, 119 Congress]2[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]34                FAIRFAX COUNTY, VIRGINIA: THE DANGEROUS5                   CONSEQUENCES OF SANCTUARY POLICIES67=======================================================================89                                HEARING1011                               BEFORE THE1213                 SUBCOMMITTEE ON IMMIGRATION INTEGRITY,14                        SECURITY, AND ENFORCEMENT1516                       COMMITTEE ON THE JUDICIARY1718                     U.S. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES1920                    ONE HUNDRED NINETEENTH CONGRESS2122                             SECOND SESSION23                               __________2425                         THURSDAY, MAY 14, 202626                               __________2728                           Serial No. 119-6829                               __________3031         Printed for the use of the Committee on the Judiciary3233               [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]3435               Available via: http://judiciary.house.gov36                                 ______3738                   U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE394063-756                     WASHINGTON : 20264142                       COMMITTEE ON THE JUDICIARY4344                        JIM JORDAN, Ohio, Chair4546DARRELL ISSA, California             JAMIE RASKIN, Maryland, Ranking47ANDY BIGGS, Arizona                    Member48TOM McCLINTOCK, California           JERROLD NADLER, New York49THOMAS P. TIFFANY, Wisconsin         ZOE LOFGREN, California50THOMAS MASSIE, Kentucky              STEVE COHEN, Tennessee51CHIP ROY, Texas                      HENRY C. ``HANK'' JOHNSON, Jr.,52SCOTT FITZGERALD, Wisconsin            Georgia53BEN CLINE, Virginia                  TED LIEU, California54LANCE GOODEN, Texas                  PRAMILA JAYAPAL, Washington55JEFFERSON VAN DREW, New Jersey       J. LUIS CORREA, California56TROY E. NEHLS, Texas                 MARY GAY SCANLON, Pennsylvania57BARRY MOORE, Alabama                 JOE NEGUSE, Colorado58HARRIET M. HAGEMAN, Wyoming          LUCY McBATH, Georgia59LAUREL M. LEE, Florida               DEBORAH K. ROSS, North Carolina60WESLEY HUNT, Texas                   BECCA BALINT, Vermont61RUSSELL FRY, South Carolina          JESUS G. ``CHUY'' GARCIA, Illinois62KEVIN KILEY, California              SYDNEY KAMLAGER-DOVE, California63GLENN GROTHMAN, Wisconsin            JARED MOSKOWITZ, Florida64BRAD KNOTT, North Carolina           DANIEL S. GOLDMAN, New York65MARK HARRIS, North Carolina          JASMINE CROCKETT, Texas66ROBERT F. ONDER, Jr., Missouri       Vacancy67DEREK SCHMIDT, Kansas68BRANDON GILL, Texas69MICHAEL BAUMGARTNER, Washington7071                                 ------7273            SUBCOMMITTEE ON IMMIGRATION INTEGRITY, SECURITY,74                            AND ENFORCEMENT7576                   TOM McCLINTOCK, California, Chair7778ANDY BIGGS, Arizona                  PRAMILA JAYAPAL, Washington,79TOM TIFFANY, Wisconsin                 Ranking Member80CHIP ROY, Texas                      JERROLD NADLER, New York81JEFF VAN DREW, New Jersey            J. LUIS CORREA, California82TROY NEHLS, Texas                    MARY GAY SCANLON, Pennsylvania83BARRY MOORE, Alabama                 DEBORAH K. ROSS, North Carolina84WESLEY HUNT, Texas                   JESUS G. ``CHUY'' GARCIA, Illinois85RUSSELL FRY, South Carolina          JASMINE CROCKETT, Texas86GLENN GROTHMAN, Wisconsin            ZOE LOFGREN, California87BRAD KNOTT, North Carolina           STEVE COHEN, Tennessee88ROBERT F. ONDER, Missouri            Vacant89DEREK SCHMIDT, Kansas                Vacant90BRANDON GILL, Texas                  Vacant9192               CHRISTOPHER HIXON, Majority Staff Director93                ARTHUR EWENCZYK, Minority Staff Director9495                            C O N T E N T S9697                              ----------9899                         Thursday, May 14, 2026100101                           OPENING STATEMENTS102103                                                                   Page104105The Honorable Tom McClintock, Chair of the Subcommittee on106  Immigration Integrity, Security, and Enforcement from the State107  of California..................................................     1108The Honorable Pramila Jayapal, Ranking Member of the Subcommittee109  on Immigration Integrity, Security, and Enforcement from the110  State of Washington............................................     3111The Honorable Jim Jordan, Chair of the Committee on the Judiciary112  from the State of Ohio.........................................     5113The Honorable Jamie Raskin, Ranking Member of the Committee on114  the Judiciary from the State of Maryland.......................     7115116                               WITNESSES117118Sheriff Stacey A. Kincaid, Fairfax County Sheriff's Office119  Oral Testimony.................................................     9120  Prepared Testimony.............................................    12121The Hon. Stephen Descano, Commonwealth's Attorney, Office of122  Fairfax County Commonwealth's Attorney123  Oral Testimony.................................................    15124  Prepared Testimony.............................................    17125The Hon. Jason Miyares, Partner, Torridon Law PLLC126  Oral Testimony.................................................    19127  Prepared Testimony.............................................    21128Jane Stoever, Professor, University of California, Irvine School129  of Law130  Oral Testimony.................................................    24131  Prepared Testimony.............................................    26132David Bier, Director, Immigration Studies, Cato Institute133  Oral Testimony.................................................    41134  Prepared Testimony.............................................    43135Sean Kennedy, President, Virginians for Safe Communities, Member136  of the Fairfax County Criminal Justice Advisory Board137  Oral Testimony.................................................    64138  Prepared Testimony.............................................    66139Cheryl Minter, Mother of victim Stephanie Minter140  Oral Testimony.................................................   124141  Prepared Testimony.............................................   126142143          LETTERS, STATEMENTS, ETC. SUBMITTED FOR THE HEARING144145All materials submitted for the record by the Subcommittee on146  Immigration Integrity, Security, and Enforcement are listed147  below..........................................................   160148149Materials submitted by the Honorable Andy Biggs, a Member of150  Subcommittee on Immigration Integrity, Security, and151  Enforcement Arizona, for the record152    An article entitled, ``Virginia murder suspect in bus stop153        stabbing had lengthy criminal history, multiple dropped154        charges,'' Feb. 27, 2026, Fox News155    An article entitled, `` `Completely failed Stephanie:' Family156        of woman killed in Fairfax County speaks out,'' Mar. 9,157        2026, 7News158    An article entitled, ``Illegal Alien With Lengthy Arrest159        Record Allegedly Butchers Woman At Virginia Bus Stop,''160        Feb. 27, 2026, Daily Caller161    An article entitled, ``The pathetic reason illegal migrant162        who `hacked mom to death' in lefty DC suburb was free--163        despite 30 arrests,'' Mar. 3, 2026, New York Post164    An article entitled, ``Grieving Virginia mother tells far-165        left prosecutor `do your job' after daughter stabbed to166        death,'' Mar. 12, 2026, Fox News167Materials submitted by the Honorable Pramila Jayapal, Ranking168  Member of the Subcommittee on Immigration Integrity, Security,169  and Enforcement from the State of Washington, for the record170    An article entitled, ``Seattle Welcoming City Policies Keep171        Immigrants Safe,'' May 14, 2026, South Seattle Emerald172    A political analysis entitled, ``Immigrants Cut Victimization173        Rates, Boost Crime Reporting,'' Aug. 26, 2025, Cato174        Institute175    An article entitled, ``Family says Virginia domestic violence176        victim didn't seek help due to immigration fears,'' Sept.177        10, 2025, NBC178    An article entitled, ``She Testified About Being Raped. Then179        ICE Showed Up,'' Apr. 6, 2026, The Atlantic180181                                APPENDIX182183Materials submitted by the Honorable Pramila Jayapal, Ranking184  Member of the Subcommittee on Immigration Integrity, Security,185  and Enforcement from the State of Washington, for the record186    A statement entitled, ``Data Matters: Fairfax County and187        National Data Support Local Policies Against Voluntary188        Cooperation with Ice,'' May 13, 2026, American Civil189        Liberties Union (ACLU)190    A statement from the UN Working Group on discrimination191        against women and girls, May 14, 2026192    A statement from the Virginia Sexual and Domestic Violence193        Action Alliance, May 14, 2026194    A joint statement from several universities, May 14, 2026195    A statement from Americans for Immigrant Justice, May 14,196        2026197198                       FAIRFAX COUNTY, VIRGINIA:199            THE DANGEROUS CONSEQUENCES OF SANCTUARY POLICIES200201                              ----------202203                         Thursday, May 14, 2026204205                        House of Representatives206207            Subcommittee on Immigration Integrity, Security,208209                            and Enforcement210211                       Committee on the Judiciary212213                             Washington, DC214215    The Committee met, pursuant to notice, at 10 a.m., in Room2162141, Rayburn House Office Building, the Hon. Tom McClintock217[Chair of the Subcommittee] presiding.218    Present: Representatives McClintock, Jordan, Biggs,219Tiffany, Van Drew, Nehls, Fry, Grothman, Knott, Onder, Schmidt,220Gill, Jordan, Jayapal, Raskin, Nadler, Scanlon, and Ross.221    Also present: Representative Cline.222    Mr. McClintock. [Presiding.] The Subcommittee will come to223order. Without objection, the Chair is authorized to declare a224recess at any time.225    I want to welcome all of you here today, and particularly226members of the public who have come to watch this hearing, but227please know the public is not allowed to disrupt the Committee228proceedings. If you disrupt today's proceedings, the Capitol229Police will have to remove you from the room, and you may be230subject to prosecution.231    Without objection, Mr. Cline will be permitted to232participate in today's hearing for the purpose of questioning233the witnesses, if a Member yields him the time for that234purpose.235    We will now begin with opening statements.236    This Subcommittee has become increasingly concerned with237so-called sanctuary policies in which local or State law238enforcement simply refuses to transfer illegal aliens who are239already in their custody to Federal authorities for240deportation, or at the very least, notify Federal authorities241about a criminal's release. Instead, these jurisdictions242release these criminals back into our communities, often with243devastating consequences.244    The doctrine of nullification, first propounded by John C.245Calhoun, holds that local or State governments may simply246ignore Federal laws that they disagree with. This doctrine,247fatal to a Federal republic, was thought to have died with the248Confederacy. These nullification or sanctuary jurisdictions now249extend to 11 States, coincidentally, the same number as the old250Confederacy.251    Fairfax County has become an epicenter of this movement.252Its Commonwealth's Attorney boasted that quote,253254        He will make charging and plea decisions that limit or avoid255        immigration consequences.256257He wrote, quote,258259        If two people commit the same crime, but only one's punishment260        includes deportation, that's a perversion of justice.261262    Thus, an illegal alien would be charged with a lesser crime263than an American citizen to protect that illegal alien from264deportation. That is the true perversion of equal justice under265law and has now prompted an investigation by the Civil Rights266Division of the Department of Justice.267    Fairfax County's sheriff takes a similar position, that her268office, quote,269270        Will not detain an individual based on an informal request or271        detainer.272273Instead of safely allowing ICE to return that criminal to his274own country, as Federal law requires, she prefers to release275him back onto her community's streets.276    Ironically, both claim this is to foster trust between277residents and law enforcement, which begs the obvious question,278can residents trust law enforcement to protect them and their279families?280    A long list of violent crimes perpetrated by criminal281illegal aliens that these officials had in their custody and282refused to prosecute and refused to remove from their283communities answers this question with poignancy.284    The most recent case is the tragic and entirely preventable285murder of Stephanie Minter, the young lady stabbed to death as286she waited for a bus. Her accused murder is Abdul Jalloh,287illegally present in the United States. Since 2022, Jalloh's288criminal history has included trespass, disorderly conduct,289drug possession, theft, larceny, and repeated arrests for290malicious wounding.291    Between January 2023 and February 2026, he had been292arrested at least 18 times. The Commonwealth's Attorney Descano293dismissed almost all these charges. At least once, Sheriff294Kincaid, instead of informing ICE that he was in custody, so295that he could be deported, and despite a detainer request from296DHS to do so, deliberately released him back onto Fairfax297County streets.298    Last year, the Fairfax County Police Department became so299alarmed at these decisions that they took the extraordinary300step of warning Descano that Jalloh had, quote, ``stabbed301multiple people, sexually assaulted at least one woman, and302committed numerous other criminal offenses.''303    The police then issued this grim prophecy, ``It is not a304question of if, but rather, when he will maliciously wound, or305worse, again.''306    Well, the ``when'' came on February 23rd. That is the day307this monster is accused of hacking Stephanie Minter to death.308She was 41 years old. She leaves behind a grieving family.309    Now, Sheriff Kincaid says she doesn't have the budget to310call ICE to pick up such criminals before she releases them311back onto the streets. Well, that begs the question, how much312does a phone call to ICE cost, and what was the cost to the313Minter family of not making that call?314    Nor is this an isolated incident. There's a growing list of315other criminal illegal aliens who these authorities had in316custody and released back onto the streets, instead of making a317simple phone call to ICE to pick this person up. It includes318illegal aliens who had their charges reduced, or even dropped319altogether, despite crimes ranging from child sex offenses to320murder.321    Of the seven homicides in Fairfax County last year, three322were committed by illegal aliens who could have been deported323before they committed these crimes. Mr. Descano's empty claim324to be the safest city of its size in the country rings hollow325against this reality.326    Just as Stephanie Minter's murder wasn't an isolated event327in Fairfax County, neither is Fairfax County an isolated328example in our country. This utter dereliction of duty is329rampant across jurisdictions that Democrats control, including330my State of California, where the Tulare sheriff recently331testified that fully half of the crimes he is dealing with332involve illegal aliens. Yet, State law forbids him from333cooperating with ICE because the Democrats don't want to334enforce our immigration laws even against criminals in custody.335    To most Americans, these policies seem reckless, dangerous,336crazy, wanton, and cruel. Today, this Subcommittee seeks to337understand how elected officials entrusted with the sacred338responsibility to protect innocent and law-abiding residents339would deliberately act in this manner.340    We will soon hear their rationale. We will hear from341witnesses the Democrats have chosen in support of these342policies, and we will also hear from the former Attorney343General of Virginia and the President of Virginians for Safe344Communities who take a very different view.345    Finally, we will hear from Stephanie's mother, who has346bravely come here today to provide a victim's statement of the347toll these policies have taken on her family and who offers a348grim warning to all Americans of what could happen to them at349any time where these dangerous policies are practiced.350    I look forward to hearing from our witnesses, and I now351yield to the Ranking Member for her opening statement.352    Ms. Jayapal. Thank you so much, Mr. Chair. Thank you to all353our witnesses for being here today.354    I want to start by offering my deepest condolences to you,355Ms. Minter. As a mother myself, I just cannot imagine the pain356that you are experiencing in losing your daughter far, far, far357too soon. I'm sorry for your loss.358    I also understand that we are joined by people from the359Fairfax community today, and I want to welcome you. If you are360willing, would you please stand up if you are from Fairfax361County? Wow, a lot of you.362    Please remain standing if you support immigrants and363support policies that make sure that everyone feels safe in364calling 911.365    I want to note for the record that everyone has remained366standing, and it looks to be a crowd of over 50 people. Thank367you so much for being here. You may be seated.368    This hearing is, unfortunately, another in a series of369hearings that the Majority has held that consistently attack370trust policies that have upheld the necessary and important371division between the enforcement of Federal civil immigration372law and the enforcement of local criminal laws. This division373has proven over and over again in documented research to be374essential in keeping all communities safe and ensuring that375people come forward to report crimes.376    Immigration enforcement is a Federal responsibility, and377last year, Republicans gave the Department of Homeland Security378over $170 billion in their Big Bad Betrayal Bill to meet the379arbitrary immigrant arrest quotas of Stephen Miller and to380carry out Donald Trump's cruel mass deportation agenda.381    Using this funding, ICE doubled in size; DHS officers382killed two U.S. citizens in cold blood in Minnesota; beat and383detained countless U.S. citizens for exercising their First384Amendment rights and broke down doors of U.S. citizens without385a warrant, in violation of the Fourth Amendment.386    We know of at least one U.S. citizen who has been arrested387by ICE three times, despite repeatedly informing agents that he388is a U.S. citizen. Another 18-year-old U.S. citizen with389terminal cancer spent the last weeks of his life begging ICE to390release his parents, so that he could see them before he died.391They reunited one day before he died. That is just what they392have done to Americans.393    ICE is also subjecting hundreds of parents and children to394months in immigration prisons, conducted senseless deportations395of military veterans, separated families, massively increased396immigration detention, resulting in a record 48 deaths in ICE397detention just since President Trump took office.398    A recent political analysis revealed that judges have ruled399in at least 10,000 cases that detention was illegal with no due400process, no opportunity for detainees to plead their cases. The40110,000 people, including a nursing mother who was separated402from her one-year-old child, despite active legal refugee403status, and a five-year-old boy detained by ICE on his way home404from school.405    More than 425 judges have heard cases and reached the same406conclusions about the illegality of Donald Trump's mass407detention policies, including, by the way, a majority of Trump-408appointed judges. Three Circuit Courts have also now ruled the409policy illegal.410    The impact of these illegal policies is not just being felt411by immigrants; it is ripping apart entire communities across412the country, creating fear and terror, and also, negatively413impacting opportunities for all Americans.414    A new study by the National Bureau of Economic Research415just concluded that Trump's immigration raids are now even416weighing on the labor market, leading to fewer jobs for U.S.-417born men without a college degree.418    Despite all this, Republicans have refused to stop these419illegal, unconstitutional, and cruel policies. They have420refused to address the fact that, while their anti-immigrant421strategies may have worked before, they don't work anymore.422Today, more than 60 percent of Americans disapprove of Trump's423immigration policies.424    Americans want Trump and Republicans to focus on lowering425their gas prices, lowering their grocery costs. They want426Republicans to stop giving tax breaks to billionaires, while427stripping healthcare from tens of millions of Americans.428    Donald Trump said it himself just a few days ago. In his429own words, Trump said, quote, ``I don't think about the430financial situation of Americans.'' Really? That is exactly why431Republicans are now planning to give ICE and Border Patrol an432additional $70 billion with no oversight or accountability, and433yet, having a hearing this morning to complain that Fairfax434County will not do ICE's job for them. Give me a break.435    DHS has plenty of money to hire all the new immigration436enforcement agents they want. They don't need to commandeer the437local police officers who are hard at work maintaining438Fairfax's status as the safest county of its size in the United439States.440    In one of the great ironies, here we are in the Immigration441Subcommittee having a hearing about the prosecutorial decisions442of a county attorney and the jail policies of a county sheriff.443Whatever happened to the Republican Party that believed in444local government?445    There are many reasons that you will hear that States and446localities choose not to or are unable to conduct immigration447enforcement on behalf of the Federal Government. Numerous court448orders have declared immigration detainers unlawful violations449of the Fourth Amendment, and State and local officials don't450want to spend huge amounts of money on court cases. State451constitutions often contain prohibitions, and local police452departments want to prioritize their already scarce resources453to encourage the trust of people to come forward and report454crimes without worrying about their own immigration status.455    The Major Cities Chiefs Association has repeatedly456reaffirmed that cooperation with the immigrant community is457essential to solve crime and prevent further criminal activity458within the entire community, including ensuring protections for459victims of domestic violence and sexual assault.460    In 2019, my home State of Washington passed the bipartisan461Keep Washington Working Act for all these reasons, as have many462States across the country. Courts have ruled multiple times463that States have the right to enact laws like the Keep464Washington Working Act. These laws do allow information sharing465with the Federal Government, when necessary for an ongoing466criminal investigation or pursuant to a court order or judicial467warrant.468    This Committee should be holding hearings on the469unconstitutionality of this administration's policies, on the470killing of American citizens by ICE and CBP, but instead, we471are doing yet another hearing designed to further this472Administration's anti-immigrant agenda and distract people from473the real issues at hand. The American people deserve better.474    I look forward to hearing from all our witnesses today, and475I yield back.476    Mr. McClintock. Thank you. I now recognize the Chair of the477Full Judiciary Committee, Mr. Jordan, for his opening478statement.479    Chair Jordan. Thank you, Mr. Chair.480    First, they let in 10 million illegal migrants during the481Biden Administration.482    Second, create sanctuary jurisdictions, which makes it483tough to remove those illegal migrants, even when they commit484another crime.485    Third, the Democrats say, ``We're not going to fund the486guys who do the removing. We're not going to fund ICE.'' They487shut down the government for 70-some days.488    Understand this: Sanctuary jurisdiction policy in simple489terms is politicians tell local law enforcement, ``Don't work490with Federal law enforcement when it comes to enforcing Federal491law.''492    That is the situation in 18 States, 11 cities--actually,493the other way around 18 cities, 11 States, three counties, and494the District of Columbia. Because those are big cities, big495States, that is almost a third of the population lives in a496jurisdiction where, again, local law enforcement is not allowed497to work with Federal law enforcement to enforce Federal law.498    Let in 10 million; create sanctuary jurisdictions, so it is499tough to remove them, even when they commit a crime; defund500ICE. Mr. Descano takes it even a step further. He takes it a501step further and says, ``I'm not even going to prosecute the502guys who do terrible things. I'm not going to prosecute them.503We're not going to honor detainers. We're going to let them out504on the street.''505    Of course, what happens when you do that? Ms. Minter is506going to talk about that in a few minutes. That's what happens.507    Take the example and take another example. Marvin Morales-508Ortez had this long rap sheet, but on September 12, 2025, he is509arrested for malicious assault and brandishing a gun. Mr.510Descano says, ``We're not going to prosecute this guy.''511Sheriff Kincaid says, ``We're not going to honor the512detainer.'' They release him on December 16, 2025.513    What happens on December 17, 2025? He kills someone. That's514the consequences of this dumb, stupid, and crazy policy.515    Again, Ms. Minter is going to talk about Stephanie Minter.516The Chair talked about Abdul Jalloh, who had these 40 past517charges, had all kinds of things. This guy had been arrested518and charged with multiple crimes, malicious wounding, stealing519property, larceny, trespass, disorderly conduct, malicious520wounding, and a hundred involvements with the local police. As521the Chair pointed out, the local law enforcement told Mr.522Descano's office, ``If you let this guy out, he's going to do523something bad. It's going to be bad.'' Sure enough, they were524right, and he stabbed and killed someone. That's the525consequences.526    Now, here's the craziest part of all. Here's the craziest527part of all, and the Chair mentioned this. Mr. Descano told us528he was going to do it. He told us he was going to do this, the529statement I think the Chair read: ``Mr. Descano's office will530take immigration consequences into account when making charging531and plea decisions.'' This is unbelievable.532    I want to thank the Chair. The Democrats can say all they533want, ``Well, why are we having another hearing?'' We are534having a hearing on this because this is the dumbest thing we535have ever heard.536    I want to thank the Chair for this hearing, and I want to537thank him for the legislation that he sponsored, that this538Committee has already passed, the Sanctuary Jurisdiction539Shutdown Act of 2026. Hopefully, that is going to be passed in540the Full House soon. Love to get that into law, so we can stop541what is going on in Fairfax County.542    With that, I yield back.543    Mr. McClintock. Thank you. I now recognize the Ranking544Member of the Full Committee, Mr. Raskin, for his opening545statement.546    Mr. Raskin. Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.547    Welcome to all our witnesses. I would especially like to548thank Ms. Minter for coming today. There's no greater pain than549the pain of losing your child. I thank you for having the550strength and the courage to speak publicly and to appear before551us about all these matters today.552    I also want to thank the busy public officials from553Virginia, Sheriff Kincaid and Commonwealth's Attorney Descano.554We know how busy your schedules are, and we thank you for555coming to be part of this process.556    I have family in Virginia. Not everybody in my family is in557Maryland. I once spent a summer in Richmond, Virginia, and I558feel somehow like I'm back in Virginia with all these great559Virginians here.560    We are on a mission of analyzing Virginia law and public561policy today. This hearing would probably be better taking562place in Richmond before the General Assembly, because we are563doing a deep dive into the prosecutorial and jail policy564decisions of one county, Fairfax County, which was recently565ranked, I noted, by the Major Cities Chiefs Association as the566safest county of its size in the entire United States of567America. Its people, its elected officials, certainly do not568deserve the contempt and the derision of this Committee.569    If we were going to superintend and scrutinize the actions570taking place within the government of Virginia, perhaps we571should be looking at the recent decision by the Virginia State572Supreme Court to overturn the expressed will of the people of573Virginia in redistricting their congressional districts. That574investigation into an episode of extreme judicial activism575might not suit the ideological purposes of the Majority quite576so much.577    The Ranking Member has done an excellent job of providing578an overview of the problems and limitations with the particular579conception of this hearing. What we have on one side is a580massively funded Federal bureaucracy, which just got $175581billion last year, accomplished by slashing funds for Medicaid,582children's health insurance, rural hospitals, and so on. DHS583now has a quarter of a million employees and a budget larger584than that of 150 countries on Earth. It has over 80,000 sworn585officers, more than the number of police officers, check this586out in New York City, Chicago, Los Angeles, Houston,587Washington, DC, Las Vegas, and Dallas combined.588    Yet, despite this massive bureaucracy and this awesome589budget, the Administration is trying to blame the problems in590immigration law and policy, over which the people of Fairfax591County have no control, other than as citizens voting for592Representatives in Congress, trying to blame these local593jurisdictions, like the sheriff's office, whose annual budget594is not $175 billion, but if the internet is correct I just595looked it up is $85 million, which is much less than 1,000th of596the Homeland Security budget.597    Yet, the Federal Government or Congress, rather than598actually engaging in the process of studying and passing599comprehensive immigration reform, prefers to bully and600scapegoat local jurisdictions which are trying to deal with the601failures of Federal policy.602    Look, ICE and the Department of Homeland Security have a603job to do and they should do it, and they should do it without604violating the law. They should do it without violating the605Constitution. They should do it without killing U.S. citizens,606like Renee Good and Alex Pretti. They have a job to do, and the607government of Fairfax County has a job to do. These public608officials have the job of enforcing the criminal laws of609Virginia, as chosen by the people of Virginia within all the610constraints of State and Federal law.611    Now, as I understand it and this is what I'm interested in,612because I'm not familiar with what is taking place in Fairfax613County, or in Virginia. As I understand it, ICE can come and614pick up undocumented prisoners for a period of days or weeks615before they are discharged.616    This has happened before, and the local and State617Government, contrary to what we just heard, cooperates fully618with the Federal Government in these cases. The idea that they619don't cooperate is just wrong.620    ICE can come and pick them up before their point of621discharge. As I understand it and I want to hear more about622this they can pick them up at the point of discharge.623    Fairfax County, as I understand it, takes the position it624cannot hold prisoners beyond the length and duration of their625lawful sentence. I want to hear about that.626    I'm curious, why can ICE not pick up with its massive627resources why can they not pick up the prisoners while they are628still being held, or right before they are about to be629released, or at the point of discharge? I don't really630understand that.631    Then, again, I understand everybody is eager to beat up on632Fairfax County for some reason, but in terms of the specific633terrible case we are going to talk about today, we are going to634hear about this Abdul Jalloh, the Sierra Leone national who is635accused of brutally murdering Ms. Minter's daughter Stephanie.636    He was actually in ICE custody from 2018-2019, during the637first Trump Administration, before they released him back into638the public, as I understand it. I want to get to the bottom of639that report. Why was he not removed back to Sierra Leone when640the Trump Administration held him in 2018 and 2019? That is a641critical question that I have in terms of trying to define642responsibility, if all this is just a blame game that we are643engaged in.644    It would be far more meaningful for us to be talking about645comprehensive immigration reform. That is what Americans and646Virginians are looking to Congress for not to be scrutinizing647and demonizing particular cities or counties around the648country, which does not strike me as a very productive649exercise.650    Nonetheless, I'm delighted to hear from all our witnesses651here, and I yield back to you, Mr. Chair.652    Mr. McClintock. Thank you. Without objection, all other653opening statements will be included in the record. We will now654hear from today's witnesses.655    We have with us today Ms. Cheryl Minter. She is a lifelong656Virginia resident. She is the mother of Stephanie Minter, the657young woman who was victimized by these sanctuary policies.658    We have with us the Hon. Stacey Kincaid, who serves as659Sheriff for Fairfax County, Virginia. She has 35 years of660experience working for the Fairfax County Sheriff's Office. A661graduate of Langley High School in McLean, Virginia, Sheriff662Kincaid received her bachelor's degree in political science and663criminal justice from the Frostburg State University in 1987.664    We have Hon. Stephen Descano, who serves as the665Commonwealth's Attorney for Fairfax County, Virginia. He has666served in this role since January 2020. Mr. Descano earned his667undergraduate degree from West Point and his JD from Temple668University.669    Mr. Sean Kennedy is President of Virginians for Safe670Communities, a public safety and victims' right advocacy671nonprofit, and sits on the Fairfax County Criminal Justice672Advisory Board as an appointee of the Fairfax County Board of673Supervisors. He is a graduate of the University of California674at Berkeley and earned a master's degree in history from the675University of Cambridge.676    Professor Jane Stoever is a Professor at the University of677California, Irvine School of Law, where she directs the678Domestic Violence Clinic and the UCI Initiative to End Family679Violence. Professor Stoever earned a bachelor's degree in680English from the University of Kansas in 2000. She completed681her JD at Harvard in 2003 and earned an LLM from Georgetown682University in 2008.683    Mr. David Bier is the Director of Immigration Studies at684the Cato Institute. He has a BA in political science from Grove685City College in Pennsylvania.686    We have with us Hon. Jason Miyares, who served as Virginia687Attorney General from 2021-2025. He previously served in the688House of Delegates. He earned a bachelor's degree in business689administration from James Madison University in 1998 and earned690his JD from the College of William and Mary in 2005.691    I want to welcome all of today's witnesses, thank them for692appearing, and we'll begin by swearing you in. Would you please693rise and raise your hand?694    Do you swear or affirm under penalty of perjury that the695testimony you're about to give is true and correct to the best696of your knowledge and information and belief, so help you God?697    Let the record reflect the witnesses have answered in the698affirmative.699    Thank you, and you may be seated.700    We note that your written testimony will be entered into701the record in its entirety. Accordingly, we will ask that you702to summarize your testimony in five minutes.703    We will begin with Sheriff Kincaid.704705             STATEMENT OF SHERIFF STACEY A. KINCAID706707    Sheriff Kincaid. Good morning. Chair McClintock, Ranking708Member Jayapal, and the distinguished Members of the709Subcommittee, thank you for the opportunity to appear before710you today.711    My name is Stacey Ann Kincaid, and I am the Sheriff of712Fairfax County, Virginia. I was sworn in as a Deputy Sheriff in7131987 and I worked my way through the ranks of my agency,714serving in every division with distinction.715    After achieving the rank of captain, I ran for sheriff in7162013 and have since been reelected three times with717overwhelming majorities. As sheriff, it's been an honor to718serve Fairfax County.719    The safety and security of Fairfax County have been my720absolute priority for the past 38 years. I entered law721enforcement to save to serve my community and to help protect722the vulnerable. I believe all those that commit crimes should723be held accountable, and I sympathize with all victims of724crimes.725    I am proud of the role my agency plays in the Fairfax726County criminal justice system by ensuring the safe and orderly727administration of justice. Simply put, the justice system comes728to a halt without the Fairfax County's Sheriff's Office.729    We are tasked with serving every document issued by our730court system, including protective orders and subpoenas. We are731responsible for providing security to our courthouse and732ensuring the safety of hundreds of thousands of courthouse733visitors every year, including judges, victims, and witnesses.734    We operate a secure and humane adult detention center, and735we hold certifications from the American Correctional736Association, the Virginia Law Enforcement Professional737Standards Commission, the Virginia Department of Corrections,738and the National Commission on Correctional Health Care739(NCCHC).740    In addition to our accreditation, I am proud of the741groundbreak-742ing, nationally recognized programs that run daily in my jail.743These efforts are critical to reducing recidivism and making744our community safer.745    The functions of my agency are carried out daily to ensure746the safe and orderly administration of justice in Fairfax747County. My agency is not staffed for, budgeted for, or mandated748to perform the duties of the Federal Government. My operating749budget is approved by State and local government and is750allotted specifically to carry out State and local mandated751functions maintaining a safe and secure detention center,752serving civil process, and ensuring the safety of the753courthouse. It is simply not the job of the Fairfax County754Sheriff's Office to engage in Federal immigration enforcement.755    Despite this, we work with ICE in significant ways. We756treat them like every other law enforcement agency we interact757with. They are allowed into our facility at any time. They are758notified of every undocumented immigrant booked into our jail759and they know their location. If there is an individual they760want to take custody of, they can do so by obtaining a judicial761warrant, calling to ask when the individual will be released,762tracking the individual's court date, or taking custody of the763individual up to five days prior to their release.764    When ICE does call, we even coordinate high-risk transfers765with ICE to ensure their safety. We have no problem with ICE766conducting its lawful business, but it is their business to767conduct, not ours.768    Fairfax County is one of the top 50 most diverse counties769in the entire Nation. Over 30 percent of Fairfax County's770population is foreign-born, and over 40 percent speaks a771language other than English at home. I am the sheriff for each772one of these residents of Fairfax County, no matter their773national origin, native language, and citizenship status.774    Ensuring trust between the community and my agency is a key775component of effective law enforcement. To encourage all776victims to put their faith in law enforcement and report777crimes, a clear separation between local law enforcement and778Federal immigration authorities is of vital importance. Local779law enforcement must offer a safe place for victims and780witnesses to cooperate without fear of consequences. This is781the only way to hold violators accountable of the law.782    Any violent crime or crime against children is a tragedy.783Unfortunately, we live in a time when such tragedies are used784for political gain. It is easy to point fingers at a time of785sadness and crisis, and to look for blame for a terrible786outcome.787    Even when everyone in the criminal justice system does788their job, terrible people will do terrible things. We are789doing our job by following the law and will continue to do so.790Hopefully, the other agencies involved will do their jobs as791well.792    I look forward to continuing this conversation with anyone793who wishes to find real solution devoid of politics.794    Thank you.795    [The prepared statement of Sheriff Kincaid follows:]796797    [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]798799    Mr. McClintock. Thank you for your testimony. Mr. Descano?800801             STATEMENT OF THE HON. STEPHEN DESCANO802803    Mr. Descano. Chair McClintock, Ranking Member Jayapal,804Chair Jordan, Ranking Member Raskin, and the distinguished805Members of this Subcommittee, as a West Point graduate, Federal806prosecutor, and now the Commonwealth's Attorney for Fairfax807County, Virginia, I have devoted my life to public service and808public safety.809    I was the first in my family to graduate from college, and810I was inspired by West Point's credo of providing a lifetime of811selfless service to the Nation.812    I was first elected as Commonwealth's Attorney in 2019 on a813promise to adopt smart-on-crime policies that prioritized the814prosecution of violent crime. I'm proud of what we have815accomplished. Fairfax County is one of the safety large816communities anywhere in the country.817    The public safety of Fairfax County motivates all my work.818Our office has successfully prosecuted thousands of cases,819including high-profile murders, sexual assaults, and other820serious offenses. We've worked with our law enforcement821partners to more effectively prosecute gun crimes; we expanded822a diversion program for struggling veterans; and we spearheaded823bipartisan, statewide reforms to better protect child victims824and witnesses, in partnership with the Republican Governor.825    Even in safe communities, though, crime does happen, like826the tragic murder of Stephanie Minter, whose mother Cheryl is827here today.828    Ms. Minter, I am deeply sorry for your loss. I say that not829only as a prosecutor, but as a parent of a daughter. I am sorry830for what you are having to endure. I promise that my office is831doing everything we can to prosecute the man responsible.832    I've been asked to testify today about my office's833policies. I welcome any conversation about how to reduce and834prevent violence. Unfortunately, I expect some will, instead,835promote a false narrative that gets us no closer to real836solutions that Americans deserve.837    Let me be absolutely clear. My office does not provide838sanctuary or safe harbor to undocumented immigrants. In fact,839we routinely prosecute immigrants who commit crimes and we will840continue to do so.841    Our approach to prosecution of crime has helped make842Fairfax County one of the safest jurisdictions of its size in843the country. Last year, we had far fewer homicides than in844almost any other major jurisdiction in the United States,845including in States that many Members of this Subcommittee846represent.847    Serious violent crime in Fairfax County is also lower than848that of most other large jurisdictions, and Fairfax residents849know it's safe. A Washington Post poll found that 94 percent of850Northern Virginia residents reported feeling safe from crime in851their neighborhood. The citizens of Fairfax County have weighed852in by reelecting me with 77 percent of the vote.853    My office also works with our Federal partners to prosecute854crimes, and like many State and local prosecutors, my office855has a policy of not assisting ICE with Federal civil856immigration enforcement. We do not have the budget or personnel857to enforce Federal civil immigration law, and it is simply not858our job.859    We handle 15,000 criminal cases each year, which are 52860full-time attorneys and a limited budget. Our policy of not861diverting our resources to Federal immigration enforcement also862makes our community safer. Three in 10 residents in Fairfax863County are immigrants. When crimes occur, we need victims and864witnesses, including members of our immigrant communities, to865report those crimes and come to court to testify. If victims866and witnesses believe my office will report them or their867neighbors to ICE, they will not trust us and they will not868provide the testimony we need to obtain convictions and get869justice.870    It is justice that my office is now seeking by prosecuting871the defendant Abdul Jalloh in the tragic murder of Stephanie872Minter. The system failed Ms. Minter, and we should all look873for ways we can prevent tragedies like this in the future. That874starts with understanding the facts.875    The defendant was well-known by ICE as early as 2018, when876ICE held him in custody for nearly two years during the first877Trump Administration, only to release him into the community.878After that, my office worked closely with law enforcement to879prosecute him and obtain convictions for his crime wherever880possible, and despite challenges in those cases.881    We are fully committed to holding the defendant accountable882in this case. As a local prosecutor, I will continue to focus883on my job prosecuting defendants who commit crimes in Fairfax884County. In carrying out that role, my office makes case885decisions based on the law, the evidence in the case, the886interests of the victim, and of service of seeking justice and887keeping our community safe.888    Thank you for having me, and I welcome your questions.889    [The prepared statement of the Hon. Descano follows:]890891    [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]892893    Mr. McClintock. Thank you for your testimony. We will next894hear from the former Attorney General of the State of Virginia,895Hon. Jason Miyares.896897              STATEMENT OF THE HON. JASON MIYARES898899    Mr. Miyares. Mr. Chair, Ranking Member, and the Members of900the Subcommittee, before I say anything else, I want to901acknowledge the woman seated with us today, Ms. Cheryl Minter,902the mother of Stephanie. She has agreed to share her story with903this Committee, and there is no one braver in this room. I will904let her speak about what she has lost, but I want to give you905is the context, because what happened to Stephanie did not have906to happen in this vacuum.907    Now, I come to the immigration issue personally. My mother908fled communist Cuba literally penniless and homeless, and not909knowing where her next meal was going to come from. She came to910this country legally, stood in line, filled out the forms, and911did everything the right way because she believed in the rule912of law and the promise of America. She left behind everything913because she knew she wanted to come here the right way. That's914what legal immigration looks like. I'm the son of a legal915immigrant; I believe in immigration deeply.916    What I do not believe in, what I cannot accept, is a system917that extends preferential treatment to those who break our laws918at the direct expense of the American citizens whose laws are919supposed to protect. In Fairfax County, Virginia, that is920precisely what happened not once, not twice, repeatedly.921    Cheryl will tell you about Stephanie. The Members of this922Committee, I want you to understand that Stephanie Minter is923not an isolated tragedy. She is the most recent and visible924name in a documented and ongoing pattern of preventable crimes,925a pattern with a single common cause: The sanctuary policies of926Fairfax County.927    In December 2025, a man was shot and killed inside his own928home in Reston, one day after Marvin Fernando Morales-Ortez, a929criminal illegal alien from El Salvador, was released from930jail, despite an active ICE detainer. He had prior arrests for931aggravated assault of a police officer. Fairfax refused to hold932him. He killed a man the very next day. A single phone call933from Fairfax to ICE would have saved this man's life.934    In November 2024, a woman was raped on a hiking trail in935Herndon, Virginia, just days after her attacker was released936from jail following a felony assault charge reduction made937without ever consulting the police. The ICE detainer was938ignored. She became the next victim.939    A four-year-old girl was nearly abducted in the middle of940the night by an illegal alien who broke into her bedroom.941Charges were reduced progressively over 18 months down to a942misdemeanor, then dropped entirely.943    In July 2024, two illegal aliens stamped a stabbed a man to944death at a park in Oakton. ICE had lodged multiple detainers on945one of the suspects that Fairfax County had refused to honor.946He was released back to the community. Then, he killed.947    In the last several weeks, girls as young as 13 were groped948repeatedly in the hallways of a Fairfax County high school by949an illegal alien enrolled as a student at age 19. ICE asked950that he be held; Fairfax refused. Same county, same prosecutor,951same policy over and over again.952    Members, this is not incompetence; this is not coincidence;953this is policy. Commonwealth's Attorney Descano publishes it on954his own website. His office's formal written policy states that955prosecutors shall, whenever possible, make charging and plea956decisions that, quote, ``limit or avoid immigration957consequences.'' That's not prosecutorial discretion; that is958discrimination against American citizens in favor of those here959illegally who commit additional crime.960    That is why the Law Enforcement Legal Defense Fund961petitioned the Department of Justice, which earlier this month962opened a civil rights investigation into Mr. Descano's office963arguing that his policies violate the Equal Protection Clause964of the 14th Amendment.965    Let me be clear about the law. Immigration is not a shared966power with States. It belonged exclusively to the Federal967Government, and Federal law expressly prohibits State and local968governments from restricting communication with Federal969immigration authorities. Fairfax County's policies do exactly970that. This is not noncooperation; this is a deliberate choice971to put a violent criminal back on the street.972    We know what works because Virginia proved it under973Governor Glenn Youngkin. His Executive Order 47 established a974State Immigration Task Force, and within eight weeks, over 130975gang members were picked up, including the East Coast leader of976the MS-13 living freely in Prince William County. He was977captured. Virginia was called the national model.978    Our new Governor Spanberger dismantled it. Her first day in979office, she signed Executive Order 1, ending State cooperation980with ICE just 19 days before Stephanie Minter was killed. She981now has a bill on her desk that would prohibit every982jurisdiction in Virginia from cooperating with ICE. I think we983all know what she will do.984    Government's first and most fundamental duty is to protect985the people it governs. Sanctuary policies represent a986catastrophic and willful failure of that duty.987    My mother came to this country because she believed the law988would protect her. Cheryl Minter believed the same thing.989Stephanie Minter deserved the same thing. Virginians are paying990the price. I'm asking this Committee to make this stop.991    Thank you, Mr. Chair. I welcome the Committee's questions.992    [The prepared statement of the Hon. Miyares follows:]993994    [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]995996    Mr. McClintock. Thank you for your testimony. We will next997hear from Professor Stoever.998999                   STATEMENT OF JANE STOEVER10001001    Ms. Stoever. Chair, Ranking Member, and the distinguished1002Members, thank you for the opportunity to testify.1003    My name is Jane Stoever, and I'm a law professor at the1004University of California, Irvine School of Law, having first1005taught at Georgetown and American, directing domestic violence1006clinics for over 20 years now.1007    Today's hearing was prompted by an unthinkable tragedy, and1008I extend my deepest condolences to Ms. Cheryl Minter for the1009loss of her daughter Stephanie Minter.1010    All victims deserve safety and justice, and many has been1011failed by the systems that purport to help them. I'll be direct1012though. Focusing on immigration enforcement as the solution to1013violence against women is rooted in false narratives, not1014facts.1015    Contrary to the premise of this hearing, sanctuary policies1016aren't obstacles to public safety; they're essential to it.1017Study after study, including by criminologist Charis Kubrin,1018shows that immigrants commit fewer crimes, and law enforcement1019leaders have warned that, when survivors fear the police,1020crimes go unreported and communities become less safe.1021    As Cochair of my county's Domestic Violence Death Review1022Team, I can assure you, preventing abuse prevents fatalities.1023Policies that allow survivors to seek help without fear, to1024call the police without fear, save lives and improve community1025safety.1026    I urge this Committee to focus on the real solutions to1027preventing and responding to violence against women, because I1028see my clients' safety further jeopardized now. Immigrant women1029in the United States face a lifetime risk of domestic1030violence--as high as 49.8 percent. That's three times the1031national average and 60 percent of immigrant women married to1032U.S. citizens experience immigration-related abuse.1033    Survivors need protection, but face a Catch 22 remains in1034danger or risk deportation. Immigration enforcement has1035exponentially increased as Congress has allocated $170 billion1036and plans to add $70 billion more. ICE agents have daily arrest1037targets and are now empowered to stop, arrest, and detain1038people on the basis of race, language, location, and1039employment, and immigrant survivors are being swept up.1040    In this context, the Alliance for Immigrant Survivors1041surveyed over 170 advocates and attorneys nationwide. Their1042findings are alarming. Over three-quarters of immigrant1043survivors have concerns about contacting the police. Seventy1044percent fear attending any court hearings, and half ultimately1045choose not to contact the police or to go to court for abuse.1046    In Virginia, Fairfax County law enforcement reports rising1047numbers of victims withdrawing complaints. Survivors are1048avoiding courthouses, food banks, prenatal care, and shelters1049due to ICE raids, and are arranging for third parties to take1050custody of their children, should they be deported.1051    At the same time, legal protections are being dismantled.1052Over 30 years ago, Congress enshrined protections for1053immigrants in the Violence Against Women Act with bipartisan1054support, and then, passed the Victims of Trafficking and1055Violence Prevention Act Protection Act. Today, survivors with1056pending, and even approved, petitions are being detained and1057removed.1058    USCIS backlogs of VAWA self-petitions and lifesaving T and1059U visas compound the crisis with U visas taking over a decade1060to grant now.1061    One of my clients married a U.S. citizen, but fled life-1062threatening abuse during pregnancy, only to be ordered removed1063unless she could prove successful adjudication of her vow of1064self-petition in one month's time. USCIS processing times are1065over four years currently. We expedited her case and awaited1066the decision on appeal. She is not the danger this1067administration or this hearing purport to address. Yet, she has1068been made a target, and I shudder to think what would happen if1069she didn't have an attorney.1070    To seriously address crime victim safety, I respectfully1071urge Congress to:1072    (1) Reject Section 287(g) agreements which harmfully1073entangle local police with Federal immigration enforcement.1074    (2) To prohibit enforcement actions at courthouses, abuse1075shelters, and medical facilities the places we want people to1076seek help.1077    (3) To bar ICE from detaining or removing individuals with1078pending survivor-based claims, as was Congress' original1079intent.1080    (4) To restore valid VAWA U and T visa protections and1081public benefits, to fund USCIS staffing, and increase the1082annual caps.1083    (5) In contrast to the hundreds of billions of dollars for1084immigration enforcement, $200 million in Federal victim1085services grants is sitting unspent, which should be immediately1086distributed to provide lifesaving services to survivors and1087those organizations, including in Virginia.1088    Please stay focused on survivor's safety and act with1089urgency to restore and strengthen vital safeguards. Thank you.1090    [The prepared statement of Ms. Stoever follows:]10911092    [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]10931094    Mr. McClintock. Thank you. We will next hear from Mr. Bier.10951096                   STATEMENT OF DAVID J. BIER10971098    Mr. Bier. Chair McClintock, Ranking Member Jayapal, and the1099distinguished Members of the Subcommittee, thank you for the1100opportunity to testify.1101    For half a century, the Cato Institute's research has shown1102that people, whatever their ancestry, background, or1103birthplace, can thrive in a free society. Our research finds1104that immigrants, legal and illegal, work at higher rates,1105generate more income and taxes, and have reduced the national1106debt by $14.5 trillion over the last 30 years. Immigrants1107improve public safety by reducing violent crime rates, meaning1108that you are less likely to become a victim.1109    Fairfax highlights this reality. About half the county's1110residents are immigrants or children of immigrants. Its1111household income is double the national average. Its murder1112rate is less than half the average. If illegal aliens in1113Fairfax were their own city, they'd have a lower homicide rate1114than 90 percent of America's largest cities and lower than the1115country's homicide rate overall. Nationwide, illegal immigrants1116are half as likely to commit serious crimes for which they're1117serving time as U.S.-born Americans.1118    Despite all this, Congress refuses to allow most would-be1119immigrants to come legally, which leads to illegal immigration.1120Just three percent of all the people seeking permanent legal1121status in the United States were approved in 2024. That was1122before the current administration banned a majority of the1123legal immigrants previously allowed to come, including half of1124all the spouses of U.S. citizens. It has cut legal immigration1125twice as much as it has cut illegal immigration. At the same1126time, it terminated legal status for over two million1127immigrants who were already here, creating four times as many1128illegal immigrants as it has deported.1129    America's cities must manage the fallout from this1130sabotaged system. Many have decided not to volunteer their1131cops, jails, and resources to DHS. DHS doesn't like that. Under1132our Constitution, cities and States don't take orders from the1133feds, and thank James Madison for that. Because we all know we1134wouldn't want the feds to dictate environmental policy, gun1135policy, or COVID policy to the states. If you want Fairfax to1136change its policies, you've got to convince them.1137    The first step would be to give up on the mass deportation1138fantasy. About one in five Fairfax residents is someone who1139could be deported or who lives with them. It would destroy1140neighborhoods, rip Americans away from their spouses, parents,1141friends, families, customers, employees, employers, nurses,1142nannies, and teachers.1143    Let me be clear: Noncitizens who harm Americans should be1144arrested, convicted, and deported. I think cities can help with1145that, but deportation is DHS's job. Indeed, you all passed the1146Laken Riley Act in 2025 to require DHS to immediately take1147custody of people charged with violence or a theft.1148    DHS is ignoring that law. It has deprioritized threats to1149focus on easy targets. They aren't tracking down the serious1150criminal fugitives like the monster who killed Stephanie1151Minter. Instead, DHS agents are racially profiling Americans at1152Home Depots, arresting spouses of U.S. citizens at green card1153interviews, beating parents of U.S. Marines, and dragging legal1154immigrants and U.S. citizens from their homes without warrants.1155    Only six percent of ICE arrests have a violent criminal1156conviction. ICE has arrested 150,000 people who have no1157criminal convictions or even charges, and we know it's not1158because they got everyone with a serious record. Stephanie's1159case and many others prove that.1160    It's because they care about, as one ICE agent put it,1161``quantity over quality.'' How many Stephanies will get1162murdered before DHS follows the law and prioritizes serious1163criminals? How many?1164    Most Americans don't want to wait for the answer. They want1165to pause the mass deportation fantasy and focus on public1166safety. That's the only policy that will defend our safety, our1167prosperity, and our freedom.1168    Thank you.1169    [The prepared statement of Mr. Bier follows:]11701171    [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]11721173    Mr. McClintock. Thank you. Mr. Kennedy?11741175                   STATEMENT OF SEAN KENNEDY11761177    Mr. Kennedy. Thank you, Chair, Ranking Member, and the1178Members of this Committee. Thank you for inviting me to1179testify.1180    My name is Sean Kennedy, president of Virginians for Safe1181Communities, a Fairfax-based public safety and victims' rights1182advocacy group, and I am an appointed member of the Fairfax1183County Criminal Justice Advisory Board.1184    I'm going to get straight to the point. Anyone who is in1185the United States without legal status, any violent criminal,1186should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law, and if1187they don't have legal status, they should be deported. Full1188stop.1189    Those aren't my words. That was Governor Abigail Spanberger1190yesterday. In Fairfax County, neither of those things are1191happening.1192    First, Fairfax chief prosecutor Steve Descano does not1193prosecute to the fullest extent of the law. In fact, one of his1194former prosecutors told me: Every time I hear Descano say,1195``community values,'' I cringe because we should be following1196the law, not his values. In fact, he openly flouts the law,1197ordering his prosecutors to seek lighter sentences for violent1198criminals and sex offenders, including murderers and child1199rapists.1200    Second, Mr. Descano boasts that he chooses which charges to1201bring and what sentences to seek, based on who is the offender.1202Being illegally present earns an offender preferential1203treatment, but that grace is not afforded to those who need it1204the most; something that the professor just spoke about1205victims. Make no mistake, the vast majority of criminal aliens'1206victims are themselves immigrants. They, too, deserve justice.1207They, too, deserve safety. They, too, deserve dignity. Mr.1208Descano has shown a callous disregard for them and their1209rights, our laws and our public safety. That is wrong and that1210is illegal, and it has appalling consequences.1211    At four o'clock in the morning on June 15, 2023, a mother1212woke to the screams of her four-year-old girl from the next1213room. A man had broken in through the bedroom window and1214carried off the toddler, committing burglary with the intent to1215rape, according to the police.1216    He was well-known to the police and Mr. Descano. He was1217Hyrum Baquedano-Rodriguez, a Honduran national. In 2021, two1218years before, Baquedano-Rodriguez was arrested for multiple1219incidents of ``indecent liberties with a child.'' Each of the1220three counts carried up to 10 years in prison under Virginia1221law, but Mr. Descano, who directs his prosecutors to avoid1222immigration consequences, reduced the charges. Despite1223committing a break-in while awaiting sentencing, Descano agreed1224to a six-month sentence for prior crimes.1225    He was quickly arrested again for burglary to commit a1226felony, punishable by 20 years, but that was reduced to1227property damage. More arrests, probation violations, and1228dropped charges followed. He walked free and went fugitive.1229    In 18 months, Baquedano-Rodriguez racked up five arrests1230and 23 charges, requiring him to spend the rest of his life in1231the Virginia Department of Corrections, but Mr. Descano's1232policies prohibited that. He'd stated that his deputies must1233``make plea offers that avoid the legislatively mandated1234minimum jail sentence.'' A criminal alien was free to abduct a1235sleeping little girl.1236    Somehow this ``parent's worst nightmare,'' in the words of1237Judge Randy Bellows, got worse when Mr. Descano gave the1238kidnapper a plea deal for less than two years in prison. An1239outraged Judge Bellows rejected the plea agreement, saying the1240only way to protect the community is a lengthy period of1241incarceration.1242    When the same deal came before Judge Susan J. Stoney the1243next year, she, too, was incredulous:12441245        The court is concerned about the severity of the crime, the1246        fact the defendant's criminal history indicates a record of1247        other involvement with minors, and that the potential sentence1248        here in this case is too lenient . . . the court has grave1249        concern in the interest of public safety.12501251    In a vindictive and petty move, Mr. Descano then dropped1252all the charges. The little girl's family was beside1253themselves. He was set to be released within hours. Denied1254justice by the same man charged with protecting the innocent,1255their little girl and the public, that family had to act.1256    The little girl's grandmother Natalie called the ICE1257hotline and said, ``I gave [them] all the information I had to1258the person on the other end.''1259    When ICE arrested him, as he walked out, she said, ``It was1260a sigh of relief.'' According to the girl's mother Christy,1261``God protected my little girl, but who is going to protect the1262next one?'' Certainly, not Mr. Descano.1263    Sadly, since he has become Commonwealth's Attorney, this1264case is not the exception; it is the rule. Under Mr. Descano,1265it is policy. Fairfax's chief prosecutor has chosen to1266sacrifice victims on the altar of ideology. Hundreds, if not1267thousands, of violent and sex crimes should never have happened1268if Mr. Descano followed the law, not his values.1269    In shielding criminal aliens, Mr. Descano shows a depraved1270indifference to human suffering. That is not compassion; it is1271cruelty. That is not compassion; it is cruelty.1272    Thank you.1273    [The prepared statement of Mr. Kennedy follows:]12741275    [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]12761277    Mr. McClintock. Thank you for your testimony. We will1278finally hear from Ms. Cheryl Minter.12791280                   STATEMENT OF CHERYL MINTER12811282    Ms. Minter. Good morning to the Members of the Committee. I1283appreciate you granting me the time and space to speak. Thank1284you for your attendance.1285    My name is Cheryl Minter. I am the mother of Stephanie1286Nicole Minter. I would like to open today's subject, Stephanie1287Nicole Minter, with a poem.12881289        Every good painting will take a million strokes. To make a good1290        song, you have to go mining to find the perfect notes. And a1291        castle is created stone by stone with patience and care,1292        because great leaps come with small steps and time.12931294    This poem comes from my favorite coffee cup, gifted to me1295by Stephanie. We would share a cup of coffee during the early1296mornings. We butted heads like every mother and daughter but1297wanted to actively take steps together to make our relationship1298better. We would share stories, memories, laughter, thoughts of1299the future, and more. This is something I will never get to1300experience again because of the failures of our justice system.1301    Stephanie was my daughter, my heart. She was a loving1302mother, a daughter, sister, an auntie, a friend, and a mentor.1303She believed in God. She cared for people. She showed up for1304others, even when was tired. Stephanie was my memory, since1305mine isn't that great anymore. She always knew the right Bible1306verse for any situation, always smiling, always joyful, always1307loved life, even through the bad times.1308    Stephanie was a woman who faced many battles in life. She1309always came out the other side of tough times with that bright1310smile on her face. That same smile is something I will never be1311able to see again a smile the world will never bear witness to1312again.1313    On February 24, 2026, I woke up to the worst call a parent1314can ever receive. My daughter was gone, taken in the most1315horrific way, while simply waiting for a bus in Fairfax County1316on the night of February 23, 2026.1317    No mother should have to stand here and say these words. No1318family should have to bury their child like this. Stephanie's1319life mattered. Her voice mattered. Her future mattered.1320    Today, I stand here because her life was taken in a way1321that should have never happened. The man who took my daughter's1322life should not have been free to walk the streets.1323    He had been picked up many times. He was known. There were1324warnings. There were emails sent saying he was a danger. Still,1325he was released.1326    I am not here for politics. I am here for accountability. I1327am here because a system failed my daughter.1328    If not for these failures, I could be sharing a cup of1329coffee with Stephanie this morning rather than speaking with1330you all today.1331    When policies protect people who are a known threat,1332innocent lives are put at risk. When warnings are ignored,1333families like mine pay the price. This is not just about1334Stephanie; this is about every mother, every parent, every1335child, and every person who waits a bus stop, walks home, or1336goes to work trusting they will be safe.1337    We cannot ignore this. We cannot look away. Compassion1338should never come at the cost of public safety. Care for one1339group should not mean danger for another. We can be a community1340that is both caring and responsible. We can have policies that1341protect people and, also, keep our streets safe.1342    That means we must act. We must listen when there are1343warnings. We must take threats seriously. We must make sure1344that people who are dangerous are not released back into our1345neighborhoods.1346    I will carry my daughter's name for the rest of my life. I1347will carry her memory, but I should not have to carry this pain1348because of a preventable failure.1349    Stephanie deserved to come home that day. She deserved to1350watch her child grow. She deserved more time.1351    I am asking you, please do not let her story be ignored. Do1352not let another family stand where I am standing. Make changes.1353Take responsibility. Protect your community. Because no mother1354should ever have to wake up to this nightmare.1355    I'd like to read from Psalms 28:13561357          Give them the punishment they so richly deserve! Measure it1358        out in proportion to their wickedness. Pay them back for all1359        their evil deeds. Give them a taste of what they have done to1360        others. They care nothing for what the Lord has done or for1361        what his hands have made. So, he will tear them down, and they1362        will never be rebuilt.13631364          Praise the Lord, for he has heard my cry for mercy. The Lord1365        is my strength and my shield. I trust him with all my heart. He1366        helps me, and my heart is filled with joy. I burst out in songs1367        of thanksgiving. The Lord gives his people strength, for he is1368        a safe fortress for his anointed king. Save your people! Bless1369        Israel, your special possession. Lead them like a shepherd and1370        carry them in your arms forever.13711372    Thank you.1373    [The prepared statement of Ms. Minter follows:]13741375    [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]13761377    Mr. McClintock. Thank you. We will now move to five-minute1378questions from Committee Members. We will start with Mr. Nehls.1379    Mr. Nehls. Thank you, sir. I'm sorry, Ms. Minter. What a1380story, Stephanie; the numerous pictures we saw, beautiful.1381    I apologize for the individuals that have held onto these1382irresponsible policies, costing the lives of many, many1383innocent Americans. I apologize. Mr. Kennedy, I appreciate your1384passion. You are right on target. Mr. Descano well, Sheriff1385Kincaid, thank you for your service. Mr. Descano, I consider1386you a disgrace.1387    I yield the rest of the balance of time to my colleague,1388Mr. Cline.1389    Mr. Cline. I thank the gentleman, and I thank the Chair for1390allowing me to sit on this panel today.1391    I represent the vast majority of Virginia citizens who1392stand with you, Ms. Minter, and who are so sorry for the1393tragedy that occurred, and our prayers are with you and with1394your daughter, who is in heaven looking down on this right now.1395    I heard your apology, Mr. Descano. I think the public would1396like to hear your resignation. Let me ask you, when Abdul1397Jalloh is released, will you honor an ICE detainer?1398    Mr. Descano. Sir, my office is a prosecuting office. We1399don't receive ICE detainers. That's not our business.1400    Mr. Cline. Will you, Sheriff Kincaid, honor the ICE1401detainer?1402    Sheriff Kincaid. Well, thank you for that question. I would1403certainly hope that this case would be prosecuted and that1404justice would be served.1405    Certainly, when it comes to Mr. Jalloh, there haven't been1406an ICE detainers, with the exception of one time in 2018, which1407we turned him over to ICE, and then, the second time, which we1408had to release him to a facility. Each time he's been in my1409custody, there's been no detainers.1410    Mr. Cline. If one comes, will you honor it?1411    Sheriff Kincaid. As long as I have the authority to do so,1412and ICE knows what our policy is.1413    Mr. Cline. Then, yes?1414    Sheriff Kincaid. If I'm given a judicial warrant, yes.1415    Mr. Cline. That's different.1416    Sheriff Kincaid. Well, it's what gives me the authority to1417detain somebody when I'm getting when I receive a court order1418from a judge mandating someone's release. I would also hope1419that ICE would know when Mr. Jalloh is getting released, so1420that they would be able to come and pick him up.1421    We do plan, should he get convicted, on taking him, driving1422him down to the Department of Corrections.1423    Mr. Cline. All right. Well, Mr. Descano, your policy tells1424prosecutors to give lighter treatment to defendants based on1425their immigration status. Isn't that just discrimination with a1426sympathetic face? Why are you protecting criminal illegal1427aliens more than the people of Fairfax County, the citizens?1428    Mr. Descano. Well, first, sir, I think there's two things1429wrong with in the question that you asked me. We're not1430protecting undocumented individuals. As a matter of fact, we1431prosecute people who commit crimes in Fairfax County,1432regardless of their status. We and so the idea that we don't do1433that is simply wrong.1434    Our policies simply maintain that our role is to prosecute1435Virginia crime. That's what we do. ICE's role is to do Federal1436civil immigration enforcement.1437    Mr. Cline. Mr. Miyares, do you disagree with that?1438    Mr. Miyares. Fundamentally. He has a written policy to that1439effect. He is conflating two different issues. He's simply1440saying, ``Well, I prosecute all crimes,'' at the same time he1441has a written policy saying that illegal immigrants are going1442to be treated and given preferential treatment differently from1443American citizens. On one hand, he sits in front of this1444Committee and says: We don't follow sanctuary policies. At the1445same time, he openly admits he conducts himself in a manner in1446which he does not cooperate with Federal immigration1447authorities. That's the very definition of sanctuary policies.1448    No, I fundamentally disagree with his assessment. There are144995 counties in Virginia, Congressman. Only one county with one1450prosecutor has a written policy saying: We're going to treat1451illegal immigrants differently than American citizens. It is1452Mr. Descano to my left, period, full stop.1453    Mr. Cline. Well, I know that when ICE does work with1454localities, the system can work. I worked in Harrisonburg,1455Rockingham Commonwealth's Attorney's Office. They had a 287(g)1456agreement with ICE. When individuals who were prosecuted who1457were here illegally eventually served their sentences, they1458were met by ICE. They were retrieved by ICE and returned to1459their countries of1460origin.1461    The people of Rockingham and Harrisonburg benefited from1462that policy because the streets were safer, and people who1463Committed crimes were not returned to the Communities that they1464threatened prior to their arrest.1465    The people who are here from Fairfax, stand and answer the1466Ranking Member's question about well, I've run out of time. I1467hope I can get some more time because people who are working1468hard in Fairfax County deserve to not just feel safe, as the1469Ranking Member indicated, but actually are safe.1470    Mr. McClintock. The gentleman's time has expired. Ms.1471Jayapal?1472    Ms. Jayapal. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Descano, there's1473been a lot said. I just want to ask you a few yes-or-no1474questions. Your office works with DHS regularly on criminal1475issues, just not civil immigration enforcement, is that1476correct?1477    Mr. Descano. That is correct.1478    Ms. Jayapal. If DHS came to you with a judicial warrant to1479take someone in your custody, would you comply?1480    Mr. Descano. Well, we don't hold people in custody, but we1481have worked with that department for criminal cases before, and1482we will continue to do so.1483    Ms. Jayapal. Do you arrest, prosecute, convict, and1484incarcerate individuals accused of crimes, regardless of1485immigration status?1486    Mr. Descano. Absolutely.1487    Ms. Jayapal. I just want to reiterate a couple of points.1488Again, yes or no. Is the crime rate in Fairfax County one of1489the lowest in the country?1490    Mr. Descano. Yes.1491    Ms. Jayapal. Is Fairfax County rated among the safest1492jurisdictions of its size by the Major City Chiefs Association?1493    Mr. Descano. Yes.1494    Ms. Jayapal. Given the ramp-up of illegal mass detentions1495and the attacks on legal immigration that Mr. Bier and others1496have spoken about, how has that played out on the ground for1497you? Are people in immigrant communities, communities of color,1498feeling safe to come forward and report crimes, testify?1499    Mr. Descano. No, they're absolutely not, and that, in fact,1500makes my job as a local prosecutor much harder. As I'm sure1501you're aware, when we do cases, we have to rely on the1502evidence. Most of the time, that evidence is through victim and1503witness testimony. We want our members of our community to come1504to court. When they're scared, as they currently are becoming1505more and more scared with what ICE is doing, they are more1506reluctant to come to court. When we don't have witnesses, that1507means, unfortunately, bad guys hit the streets again. As a1508prosecutor, that's what I don't want. That's what my trust1509policy is trying to avoid.1510    Ms. Jayapal. Thank you. Professor Stoever, I want to turn1511to you. Immigrant women experience domestic violence at rates1512nearly three times the national average and are often among the1513most vulnerable, because the fear of deportation can keep them1514trapped in these abusive situations. I have done a lot of work1515on this issue, as you know.1516    In your work, you have written about the importance of1517trust between immigrant communities and local law enforcement.1518When immigrant communities know that calling 911 will not1519result in deportation for themselves or a family member, they1520are more willing to report and help law enforcement solve1521crimes.1522    Can you discuss how local police working too closely with1523ICE can undermine that trust, and whether this Administration's1524aggressive immigration policies are making it harder for1525domestic violence survivors to come forward and seek help?1526    Ms. Stoever. Yes, thank you for your work on this area. It1527absolutely undermines trust. When you have law enforcement, and1528that the line between law enforcement and immigration1529enforcement blurred, when you call the police, you don't know,1530when they show up at your door, are they there to help or to1531deport you. It's absolutely created a chilling effect and1532really suppressed people coming forward to get help, which then1533causes greater danger for the broader community.1534    I'll identify just one survivor quote from a survivor1535reaching out to a local service provider, who said her abuser1536would tell her, quote, ``Look at the TV''--referring to the1537coverage of immigration raids and the rhetoric about1538immigrants, ``see how no one cared about her.''1539    This is really creating a very significant chilling effect1540for abuse survivors and continuing to escalate abuse.1541    Ms. Jayapal. I'm hearing a lot about that from survivors in1542my own district.1543    Mr. Bier, I want to thank you for all your research on1544Trump's attacks on the legal immigration system. He, of course,1545said he was going to go after ``the worst of the worst,'' and1546that is, clearly, not what is happening.1547    Republicans want to force States and localities to comply1548with these mass deportation policies, and they want to threaten1549to cut billions in law enforcement, public safety, and national1550security funding to the jurisdictions that refuse to comply.1551    (1) Can the Federal Government force States and localities1552to do the Federal Government's job?1553    (2) Why is it not in the interest of the public and public1554safety to force local jurisdictions to do this?1555    Mr. Bier. Well, first, the 10th Amendment puts a firewall1556in place. We have a system of federalism. The Supreme Court has1557been quite clear on this. You cannot force State and local1558governments to do what you want. Congress' powers are limited.1559You can order the Federal agencies to do whatever you want; you1560cannot, as you know, as long as it comports with the1561Constitution, of course, but you cannot tell the States and1562local governments what to do.1563    You also cannot use your Federal grant-making authority as1564a backdoor to coerce States into doing what they want. The1565Republicans, and certainly myself and the Cato Institute, were1566quite happy in the Obamacare decision, where they said you1567can't force Medicaid expansion on States by denying all1568Medicaid to States that don't cooperate. That was a protection1569of federalism, and we should continue and defend the Federalist1570system of government from these attacks.1571    Mr. McClintock. The gentlelady's time has expired.1572    Ms. Jayapal. Thank you.1573    Mr. McClintock. Mr. Biggs?1574    Mr. Biggs. Thank you, Mr. Chair. First, specifically, Ms.1575Minter, for being here today. It takes a great deal of courage,1576and I appreciate your being here.1577    I thought it was an interesting thing when we heard that1578Americans care about their microeconomy. Do you know what they1579really care about? Because if you have money and you are1580unsafe, it is like you don't have money. You need to be safe.1581That is what Americans really care about. First, you need to be1582safe. Americans want to be safe.1583    I thought it was interesting, too, when the Ranking Member1584said, ``hey, stand up here if something to the gallery if you1585support immigrants,'' so that they are able to make 911 calls.1586I thought that was interesting. Everybody stood up, and then, a1587few sat down.1588    Do you know who can't stand up today? Do you know who is1589not here today? The victims of the crimes of those individuals1590that were released into the community, knowing that they had a1591propensity to commit these types of crimes. They're not here to1592answer for themselves.1593    That is why we have ostensibly, that is why you have the1594police agencies.1595    I thought I would tell you, do you know who is not here?1596Ms. Minter's wonderful daughter Stephanie. She's not here,1597because Abdul Jalloh was released.1598    A victim of Maldin Anibal Guzman who was killed is not1599here.1600    The victim of Marvin Fernando Morales-Ortez is not here. He1601was killed. He was killed. Released by these individuals.1602    Wilmer Osmany Ramos Giron, the victim of his strangulation1603is not here.1604    The victim of Jorge Armando Melendez-Gonzalez, charged 191605times for violent and firearm-related incidents, is not here.1606The victims cannot be here.1607    The victim of Hyrum Baquedano-Rodriguez the judge found1608what Mr. Descano's office, his plea agreement was so offensive,1609they rejected them. Then, a second judge rejected the plea1610offer. The victims there, they are not here today.1611    Denis Humberto Navarette Romero, again, and we could go on1612and we could name these victims who are not here because of the1613policies of this Fairfax County office.1614    With that, I'm going to yield two minutes, the last two1615minutes to my friend from Virginia, Mr. Cline.1616    Mr. Cline. I thank the gentleman for yielding.1617    I want to get back to this idea that Fairfax is somehow a1618standout for keeping crime low. In fact, they are ranked No. 31619nationally by release volume out of sanctuary strongholds1620across the country that routinely disregard detention requests1621from ICE. Behind Santa Clara County's main pretrial holding1622facility in California and Chicago's Cook County jail in1623Illinois. The number of releases is third nationally. It is1624actually an embarrassment.1625    From October 2022-February 2025, the Fairfax County Adult1626Detention Center freed more than a thousand deportable illegal1627immigrants from lockup, in direct defiance of over 1,1501628detainers lodged by ICE.1629    The people who the Ranking Member wants to feel safe in1630Fairfax, without worrying about whether they are actually safe,1631are scared to walk home, are scared to take the bus to work, or1632if they are staying in a part of Fairfax that is not the best1633part of Fairfax, that they are going to encounter a criminal1634that is on release from the Fairfax County Jail.1635    To Mr. Bier, Congress does have limited powers, but we do1636have the power of the purse. It becomes increasingly clear1637that, for those jurisdictions that are happy to take Federal1638tax dollars when it comes to COPS grants and I'm a supporter of1639COPS grants but when those jurisdictions are not actually1640implementing policies that create safe communities, that make1641maybe people feel safe because you talk about ``feeling safe,''1642but are you actually safe in your community? In Fairfax,1643arguably, no, I would say they are not.1644    Making those COPS dollars contingent on 287(g) agreements1645is very legal, is very possible. You can shake your head--1646    Mr. Bier. No, no, it's definitely not--1647    Mr. Cline. I didn't ask you a question.1648    Mr. Bier. I mean, you can read.1649    Mr. Cline. I didn't ask you a question.1650    Mr. Bier. Well, you--1651    Mr. Cline. It is quite legal. The bill that I have1652introduced would do just that.1653    Mr. McClintock. The gentleman's time has expired.1654    Mr. Cline. I yield back.1655    Mr. McClintock. The Chair recognizes Mr. Raskin.1656    Mr. Raskin. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Did you want to address1657that, Mr. Bier?1658    Mr. Bier. Yes, really quickly. We have multiple appeals1659courts' decisions directly on the point of denying funding to1660jurisdictions based on the fact that they have Democratic1661leadership.1662    The point about the Medicaid expansion in the Obamacare1663case, it was directly related. It was healthcare spending that1664they were making contingent on expanding Medicaid. The Supreme1665Court said you cannot coerce States and localities to adopt1666Federal policy using money in this way.1667    There's no question it's unconstitutional for Congress to1668do this.1669    Mr. Raskin. Then, that is the position anyone who is a real1670champion of federalism and States' rights would hold, which is1671what you can't do indirectly. You can't do it indirectly1672through the coercive use of money. You can't give a State a1673``godfather offer,'' which is, basically you do what we say or1674else.1675    Commonwealth's Attorney Descano, Sheriff Kincaid, I don't1676know if either of you can answer a few questions I have got.1677    It seems to me like the whole premise of this hearing is to1678blame you for the terrible murder and tragedy of Stephanie1679Minter.1680    Here's what I don't understand. The guy was being held for1681two years in 2018 and 2019 by ICE under the first Trump1682Administration. Why was he not deported then? Why did he end up1683back on the streets? Why didn't ICE release him? Can you tell1684me why, Mr. Descano? Do you know? Or Ms. Kincaid?1685    Sheriff Kincaid. Well, that's a good question, and that's1686something that I would refer to ICE on, because they did have1687him in custody. When he showed up back in our jurisdiction in16882022 we wondered the same.1689    Mr. Raskin. Yes It is just fascinating to me that we have1690got seven witnesses here, and somebody else who is not here, in1691addition to Stephanie, is ICE. ICE cannot account for well, I1692will get to you if I have got enough time.1693    That is baffling to me. That is puzzling. I have been1694asking about that for the last couple of days. Somebody said,1695``well, he was from Sierra Leone, and Sierra Leone didn't want1696to take him back.'' Of course, as we know, this Administration1697has no problem deporting people to third countries, third-party1698countries, removing them to third-party countries.1699    Why wasn't he removed by ICE? They are the only ones who1700have got the power to kick him out of the country. You don't1701have the power to deport him, do you, State's Attorney?1702    Mr. Descano. No, sir, I don't have the power, and quite1703frankly--1704    Mr. Raskin. Yes.1705    Mr. Descano. --there's nothing in my policies, if somebody1706is deportable when they come to my office, there's nothing in1707my power to change that.1708    Mr. Raskin. OK. Do you know exactly how many violent crimes1709he committed before he was in the custody of ICE? Because there1710were reports that he had committed a stabbing and some1711assaults.1712    Mr. Descano. I don't know the exact number, but there I1713believe there were multiple--1714    Mr. Raskin. OK. ICE was aware. This guy is a violent1715criminal. They are holding him and they release him back on the1716streets. Then, you do your job, and your only job, which is to1717prosecute those offenses. You did that, right?1718    Mr. Descano. Yes, sir, and we got a multiyear jail sentence1719as well.1720    Mr. Raskin. OK. Sheriff Kincaid, if I'm understanding you1721properly, ICE did not issue detainers when he was held for1722those offenses. They did once, and you complied with it. On the1723other ones, they didn't issue as I understand it, ICE didn't1724come forward with a detainer until after Stephanie Minter was1725killed. Is that right?1726    Sheriff Kincaid. A time before when we had to relocate this1727individual to a different facility. Other than that, there were1728no detainers at all.1729    Mr. Raskin. OK. Again, I feel like we are in a courtroom in1730Fairfax County, Virginia, or in the Richmond legislature.1731Obviously, if somebody doesn't like the job that the sheriff is1732doing, if somebody doesn't like the job that the Commonwealth's1733Attorney is doing, run against them.1734    One of these sounded Mr. Kennedy, you sounded like a1735campaign speech you were making. You have got the right to run1736against him. Have you faced a reelection yet, Commonwealth--1737    Mr. Descano. Yes, sir, I won with 77 percent of my1738community's vote.1739    Mr. Raskin. Are you elected, Sheriff Kincaid, or are you1740appointed?1741    Sheriff Kincaid. No, I'm elected.1742    Mr. Raskin. Have you won reelection?1743    Sheriff Kincaid. Several times with the majority of the1744vote.1745    Mr. Raskin. OK. I take it that all these issues, which are1746complicated, which are a result of the failure of Congress to1747actually engage in comprehensive immigration reform, are1748heavily debated in Fairfax County. We don't need to kick off1749your next reelection with debates here about your performance1750in office. That is beneath the dignity of this Committee to be1751telling local officials they should be defeated or should1752resign from office. That doesn't make sense to me.1753    Mr. Bier, what should Congress be doing to get us out of1754this constant immigration nightmare? We almost had a ``Big1755Bipartisan Deal'' at the end of 2024. Everybody in the Senate1756agreed to it. All the Democrats in the House agreed to it.1757Then, I think Donald Trump said, ``I don't want a deal. I want1758an issue to run on.'' Is that right?1759    Mr. Bier. The bottom line is, as you said, we need--1760bipartisan immigration reform.1761    Mr. McClintock. Excuse me. Mr. Bier, suspend for a moment.1762The gentleman's time has expired.1763    I will give you a very brief time to answer that question.1764You can also respond to it in later questions.1765    Mr. Bier. We need to get back to legality and orderly1766immigration. That means a process for people who are peaceful1767people to get legal status, and for people who are peaceful to1768come here legally. That's bipartisan immigration reform, in my1769opinion.1770    Mr. McClintock. Chair Jordan?1771    Chair Jordan. Thank you, Mr. Chair.1772    Mr. McClintock. Oh, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. Let me, first,1773introduce Mr. Biggs for a unanimous consent request.1774    Mr. Biggs. I'm sorry. Thank you, Mr. Chair. I'm sorry, Mr.1775Chair.1776    Here's a series of articles. I will just do a few of them,1777and then, give the whole stack to you:1778    (1) ``Virginia Murder Suspect in Bus Stop Stabbing Had1779Lengthy Criminal History, Multiple Dropped Charges.''1780    (2) Abdul Jalloh Allegedly Killed Stephanie Minter at1781Fairfax County Bus Shelter After Prosecutors Dropped Charges in1782Most Previous Cases. ``Completely Failed Stephanie.''1783    (3) ``Illegal Alien with Lengthy Arrest Record Allegedly1784Butchers Woman at Virginia Bus Stop.''1785    Then, there is a whole stack of others which I won't read,1786but will just submit for the record, if that's OK, Mr. Chair.1787    Mr. McClintock. Without objection. Chair Jordan?1788    Chair Jordan. Thank you. Sheriff, why did you let Marvin1789Morales-Ortez out of jail?1790    Sheriff Kincaid. Because I received a court order, a1791judicial order from a judge ordering his release.1792    Chair Jordan. Because the guy beside you wouldn't prosecute1793him, right?1794    Sheriff Kincaid. You'd have to talk to him.1795    Chair Jordan. This guy, the guy beside you, wouldn't1796prosecute the guy who was an illegal migrant who had been1797charged with six different crimes; who was arrested for murder1798in 2020; who, in 2023, assaulted a police officer, and who, in1799September 2025, was charged with aggravated malicious wounding1800and brandishing a gun. That guy is released; you can't hold him1801because he is not going to be prosecuted, is that right?1802    Sheriff Kincaid. I'm not sure about, you know--1803    Chair Jordan. Well, that is what you told us. You sent us a1804letter on March 11, 2026, addressed to me and Chair McClintock.1805You said, ``On December 16, 2025, the Commonwealth's Attorney1806moved to not prosecute the charges of aggravated malicious1807wounding and brandishing a firearm by Mr. Morales-Ortez.'' You1808had to let him out, didn't you?1809    Sheriff Kincaid. Through a court order by a judge, yes, I1810did.1811    Chair Jordan. You had to let him out.1812    Sheriff Kincaid. I was ordered to release him by a judge.1813    Chair Jordan. I see you have got some of your deputies1814behind. How is morale in your department, Sheriff? Is it good?1815    Sheriff Kincaid. I didn't know I was here to talk about1816morale, sir, but based on what I--1817    Chair Jordan. You are here to answer the questions we ask1818you; that is what you are here for, yes.1819    Sheriff Kincaid. Of course, I am.1820    Chair Jordan. OK.1821    Sheriff Kincaid. I'm also here to talk about what I was1822invited here to talk about.1823    Chair Jordan. Well, I will refer you to a statement you1824made in August, ``Fairfax County Sheriff Stacey Kincaid, a1825Democrat, also told 7 News reporter Nick Minnick, `It's1826shameful the way things have not been prosecuted.' '' Do you1827stand by that statement?1828    Sheriff Kincaid. If that's what was written, I do.1829    Chair Jordan. No, I'm not asking if that is what was1830written. I'm saying, did you say that and do you stand by that?1831Is that having an impact on morale?1832    Because most of the police departments I know, and sheriffs1833and deputies that I know, when they get the bad guys off the1834street, they like to see them prosecuted, so they don't come1835back on the street, harm the community you are supposed to1836protect, and make their job tougher, because they have got to1837go get them again when they commit some other crime.1838    That is why I asked the morale question, in light of your1839statement just a few months ago where you said it's shameful1840that the guy beside you is not prosecuting people.1841    Sheriff Kincaid. I did.1842    Chair Jordan. You said that?1843    Sheriff Kincaid. I did.1844    Chair Jordan. OK. Good. Mr. Descano, why did you change1845your website?1846    Mr. Descano. Sir, first, let me address what you said1847earlier.1848    Chair Jordan. No, no, no. You answer the questions we ask.1849You answer the questions we ask. I asked a simple question. Why1850did you change your website last month?1851    Mr. Descano. Well, sir, your statement about we're not--1852don't want to prosecute guys is absolutely false. My policies1853so far in this hearing.1854    Chair Jordan. I'm reading what you are saying what the1855sheriff wrote me is wrong?1856    Mr. Descano. No, what I'm saying is, that the way that my1857policies have been presented in this are outrageous.1858    Chair Jordan. December 16th, you tell that she said, ``The1859Commonwealth's Attorney'' that's you chose not to prosecute Mr.1860Morales-Ortez, on December 16th, and they had to release him.1861They had to do their job. Because you wouldn't prosecute, what1862happened on December 17th, Mr. Descano?1863    Mr. Descano. Well, sir, let's talk about December 16th--1864    Chair Jordan. No, no, that's the question. What happened on1865December 17th--1866    Mr. Descano. Well, sir, you got the nuanced--1867    Chair Jordan. This guy murdered somebody. This guy murdered1868somebody. I'm asking you, why did you change your website?1869    Mr. Descano. Well, do you not want me to talk to you about1870the actual case?1871    Chair Jordan. I want you to answer the first question I1872said.1873    Mr. Descano. Which was about the case, sir.1874    Chair Jordan. Why did you change your website?1875    Mr. Descano. Well, sir, because the website is not my1876policy. My policy, you--1877    Chair Jordan. I think the voters--1878    Mr. Descano. You are referring to a campaign web--1879    Chair Jordan. I think the voters might be interested in1880that.1881    Mr. Descano. No, sir--1882    Chair Jordan. This is your campaign website where you said,1883``Our office will take immigration consequences into account1884when making charging and plea decisions.''1885    Immigration consequences were certainly part of the game1886here, part of the issue here with Mr. Morales-Ortez.1887    Mr. Descano. No, they weren't.1888    Chair Jordan. You decided not to prosecute him.1889    Mr. Descano. They absolutely were not.1890    Chair Jordan. You decided--1891    Mr. Descano. You are assuming something that is not--that1892is, in fact, untrue, because you are misrepresenting my1893policies. My policies do not say that we do not prosecute1894people because of their immigration status.1895    Chair Jordan. Well, if you're proud of your policies, why1896did you change your website?1897    Mr. Descano. Because that's not my policy. As I told you,1898sir that is a campaign statement--1899    Chair Jordan. Well, Mr. Descano--it had been up for six1900years.1901    Mr. Descano. --that I made before I was Commonwealth's1902Attorney.1903    Chair Jordan. A week after we send you a letter saying we1904want you to come to testify, shazam, you have changed it.1905    Mr. Descano. Because I could not--1906    Chair Jordan. I'm just asking, is that coincidental?1907    Mr. Descano. Because I could not believe that somebody,1908that people were so obtuse that they could not realize what the1909difference between a campaign statement and an actual office1910policy is.1911    Chair Jordan. When you make campaign statements, that's1912not--those aren't true? You're not being honest with your1913voters?1914    Mr. Descano. That's not what I'm saying at all, sir.1915    Chair Jordan. It sure sounded like it.1916    Mr. Descano. What I am saying--1917    Chair Jordan. It sure sounded like it.1918    Mr. Descano. It's absolutely not. What I'm saying is that,1919when you--1920    Chair Jordan. You still haven't told me--1921    Mr. Descano. --write office policies--1922    Chair Jordan. --why you took it--you still haven't told me1923why you took it down.1924    Mr. Descano. Because I was hoping to come here to talk1925about my office policies, not be distracted by a campaign1926statement that was made--1927    Chair Jordan. Not be distracted? This is--1928    Mr. Descano. --a year before I was actually Commonwealth's1929Attorney--1930    Chair Jordan. Attorney General, Attorney--1931    Mr. Descano. --and had any cases that were mine.1932    Chair Jordan. This is almost laughable. This is your1933policy. You said it right here. You told the voters: If you1934elect me, I will take into account immigration consequences1935when making charging and pleading decisions.1936    Mr. Descano. This is my policy, not what you have in your1937hand.1938    Chair Jordan. Oh, OK. What you said to the voters is not1939real? It doesn't count?1940    Mr. Descano. No, sir, what I'm saying is that, as an office1941holder--1942    Chair Jordan. I just find it interesting--1943    Mr. Descano. --my office is run by my policy.1944    Chair Jordan. Your sheriff said you wouldn't prosecute.1945This guy gets released; kills someone the next day. We started1946asking about it. You change your website and take down the1947statements that say you're going to take into account1948immigration consequences when you decide what--1949    Mr. Descano. Well, my policy is public--1950    Chair Jordan. --when you decide what you are going to1951charge.1952    Mr. Descano. --and it has been public the entire time I've1953been in office, sir.1954    Mr. McClintock. The gentleman's time has expired. Ms. Ross?1955    Ms. Ross. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank you to the Ranking1956Member.1957    To our witnesses who--I know Mr. Bier has been here before.1958He is familiar with how this Committee rarely works on getting1959to the root of a problem and finding a bipartisan solution. I1960think this hearing is a perfect example of that.1961    To Ms. Minter, I am deeply, deeply sorry for your loss. No1962one this Committee, regardless of political party, wants1963criminals roaming the street, whether they are here illegally1964or whether they are U.S. citizens. What happened to your1965daughter is a travesty, and I am so, so sorry.1966    I also want to apologize to Sheriff Kincaid. This is Police1967Week. This is the week where we lift up what you and your team1968do to keep our communities safe. It is clear from your1969testimony that that is your sole focus. As the first person1970here to actually recognize that, I want to thank you for your1971service and I want to thank the officers that you brought along1972with you.1973    Sheriff Kincaid. Thank you.1974    Ms. Ross. State and local law enforcement officers know how1975to do their jobs. You have to build trust with community1976members to do your job. You have to build trust with those1977members to get them to bring crimes to your attention and to1978get the evidence you need to prosecute people who have done1979things that are just horrible, like in the case of Ms. Minter.1980    Victims of crime also need to know that if they go to law1981enforcement to report a crime, they will not themselves be1982either detained or deported, or something happen to them.1983Otherwise, we won't be able to deal with people in a civil1984society.1985    I'm going to start with Mr. Bier because he is very1986experienced before this Committee. He has done a great deal of1987research on the topic of immigrants and crime.1988    Before President Trump came to office, were immigrants more1989or less likely to report crime and I'm not just talking about1990illegal immigrants; I'm talking about all immigrants,1991naturalized; people who are here legally more or less likely to1992report crime and cooperate with the police compared to U.S.1993citizens?1994    Mr. Bier. They were more likely, according to the Crime1995Victimization Survey, which is administered by the Department1996of Justice every year, more likely to report crimes to the1997police than U.S.-born individuals. That also holds true for1998noncitizens who half of whom are in the country illegally at1999that time.2000    Ms. Ross. Are immigrant victims of crimes, including those2001who have legal status and how are they treated when they report2002a crime or go to court to testify?2003    Mr. Bier. Well, right now, the Administration is targeting2004people who go to courthouses. They're arresting witnesses and2005victims of crimes. They're working with State and local2006jurisdictions that will cooperate with them to make arrests.2007    We've seen individuals for example, in Palm Beach, Florida,2008an individual called 911, a welfare check on his four-year-old2009daughter. ICE worked with the Florida police to arrest him2010after he called 911. He couldn't believe it; he was shocked2011that in America they would prioritize arresting someone based2012on effectively, he was an asylum seeker. He had an asylum2013application pending. It didn't matter. The ICE laughed at that2014because they don't consider that a basis to argue against2015detention anymore.2016    Ms. Ross. My understanding is that, last year, ICE agents2017event tackled a rape survivor in a courthouse after she gave2018sworn testimony in a case against a rapist.2019    Mr. Bier. Correct.2020    Ms. Ross. That has been widely reported. OK. Well, thank2021you for that.2022    I only have a few seconds left. I want to ask Professor2023Stoever, have you seen situations where victims specifically2024declined to call the police because they feared immigration2025consequences for themselves or their family members; thus,2026allowing violent criminals to go free?2027    Ms. Stoever. Yes, I absolutely have.2028    Ms. Ross. Have you had those incidents when the criminal2029was a citizen of the United States?2030    Ms. Stoever. Yes, actually, more often than not, when the2031actual abuse perpetrator is a citizen.2032    Ms. Ross. That means citizens of the United States are not2033being prosecuted, is that correct?2034    Ms. Stoever. Correct.2035    Ms. Ross. Thank you, Mr. Chair. I yield back.2036    Mr. McClintock. Mr. Van Drew?2037    Mr. Van Drew. Thank you, Mr. Chair.2038    I want to bring this--the other side has brought us the2039``Bizarro World,'' and I want to bring this to the world of2040reality.2041    First, I want to say to you, Ms. Minter--and I mean--I know2042you hear crocodile tears from politicians; you hear how sorry;2043you hear how sad; you hear the condolences. None of that does2044it justice. There are no words I can ever say. I say this every2045time we have another victim's family here. I pray to God2046there's a day when this no longer happens and we don't have to2047have these hearings.2048    We are going to have them with the good leadership of our2049Chair and this Committee, because it needs to be talked about.2050If it needs to be talked about over and over again, and good2051Americans like you are willing to be here, because you love2052your children, because you loved her, and you are willing to2053stand up, I applaud you.2054    Because more than a condolence, and more than any of that,2055is, when somebody says that to you, say, ``Change the policy.2056Don't let it happen to somebody else.'' It shouldn't happen to2057anybody. God help you; I don't know how you do it, but we are2058praying for you.2059    Second, when I say I want to bring this out of ``Bizarro2060World,'' I was thinking about all the empty, a lot of times,2061people gather around the kitchen table. Stephanie Minter's2062chair, that chair at the table is empty tonight; Laken Riley's2063chair is empty tonight; Rachel Morin's chair is empty tonight;2064and Jocelyn Nungaray's chair. They are all human beings. They2065are all human souls that have families that love them, and they2066love their family. They are gone.2067    We have got more than that. We could spend the whole time2068here reading lists of people who have been murdered, hurt,2069beaten, and raped because of what has happened and these2070policies. They are human beings.2071    Do you know what the worst of it is? Not the most important2072part, but on top of all it, we are paying for all this.2073Sanctuary States and sanctuary cities cost a fortune.2074    The State of New Jersey, where I am, they estimate and this2075is not me; this came out in publications $7.3 billion not2076million billion every year because of sanctuary policies. That2077is a lot of money for people who are really squeezed. It is2078horrible and it shouldn't happen.2079    Also, I want to allude to the fact, you have people who are2080worried about, sometimes when ICE goes into where there is a2081church, where there is a department store, or there is a school2082nobody really wants that. Do you know why that is happening? It2083is happening predominantly in Blue States because the local law2084enforcement State, county, and local in sanctuary States are2085not allowed to cooperate, where normally they would turn2086somebody over to ICE, and you wouldn't have to go through that2087process. If we all cooperated and worked together and cared2088about the people we serve, we'd be in better shape.2089    Mr. Descano, a simple question. Are American communities2090safer when illegal immigrants who commit crimes are deported or2091when they remain in those communities? Are they safer when they2092are deported, the communities, yes or no? Just yes or no.2093    Mr. Descano. Well, sir, that's not--2094    Mr. Van Drew. Yes or no. Yes or no? I'm asking the2095questions. You will give me the answer then.2096    Mr. Descano. I'm trying to answer them.2097    Mr. Van Drew. No, you are--2098    Mr. Descano. Because you asked me a question--2099    Mr. Van Drew. You have been--2100    Mr. Descano. --that's outside of my purview. I can tell2101you--2102    Mr. Van Drew. Jim Jordan down there asked you questions.2103You are a human being. You are sitting next to a woman who lost2104her daughter. Can you tell me if illegal criminals are removed2105from the country, if we are safer?2106    Mr. Descano. To suggest that I don't care--2107    Mr. Van Drew. No.2108    Mr. Descano. --about what happens in my community--2109    Mr. Van Drew. Well, this is my time.2110    Mr. Descano. I go to work every day trying to protect my2111community.2112    Mr. Van Drew. You are going to answer my questions. You are2113going to answer my questions. You don't show any discipline.2114When I'm asked questions, I answer them. you are not willing to2115answer that question? OK.2116    I ask you this question: Let's talk about Abdul Jalloh. Yes2117or no, would Stephanie Minter be alive today if he had been2118deported?2119    Do you know why he wasn't deported? Because, quite frankly,2120the Administration was not as aggressive, and if a country2121didn't want to accept these awful people that came from the2122country, we didn't know where to send them and we held them and2123we detained them. Now, we are finding places to send them, so2124that this doesn't go on.2125    That is the answer. That is why that happened. It is not a2126mystery. It is not something weird or unusual. They didn't know2127where the heck to put them. Now, we just do it and we get it2128done.2129    Nevertheless, would we be safer if he wasn't in the country2130then? Would we be safer, yes or no?2131    Mr. Descano. Sir, your--2132    Mr. Van Drew. Yes or no, would it be safer if the man2133wasn't in the country?2134    Mr. Descano. Of course--2135    Mr. Van Drew. Damn it, answer my question.2136    Mr. Descano. Sir, I'm trying. You keep changing the2137question.2138    Mr. Van Drew. No, it is yes or no. There is a bad guy that2139murders people. Are we safer if he is not in the country?2140    Mr. Descano. Certainly, If somebody is--if some--2141    Mr. Van Drew. No. You didn't answer the question. I'm2142sorry.2143    I will ask you this: Explain to the lady next to you. Abdul2144Jalloh was charged in your county more than 40 times, not four2145times, 40 times. Your office dropped the charges in almost2146every single case. That is fact. We have it documented. We can2147look at it.2148    Your own Fairfax County Police Department wrote your office2149we have it; it is fact May 2025 saying: He has shown a quote,2150``blatant disregard for human life'' and was a danger to the2151community; and that if he wasn't detained and deported, he2152would seriously hurt someone or kill someone. The very man went2153out, and then, killed someone.2154    The question is, couldn't we have done better there?2155    Mr. McClintock. The gentleman's--yes, the gentleman's time2156has expired.2157    Mr. Van Drew. I know.2158    Mr. McClintock. I will take that as a rhetorical question.2159Mr. Nadler is recognized.2160    Mr. Nadler. Thank you, Mr. Chair.2161    Mr. Chair, this Subcommittee has hardly been busy this2162year. Clearly, Republicans have no desire to conduct oversight2163of the Trump Administration's brutal and reckless campaign to2164strike fear in immigrant communities across the country. They2165don't want to draw more attention to an out-of-control2166Department of Homeland Security that lets masked agents murder2167American citizens and tear children away from their parents.2168    They can't manage to hold a hearing about ICE detention2169facilities that fail to meet the basic medical needs of2170detainees and have their highest death rates in decades.2171    They certainly have no interest in holding a hearing to2172justify the Republican plan to hand a $70 billion blank check2173to the Trump Administration to advance its reckless, chaotic,2174and inhumane immigration policies, when it hasn't even spent2175most of the money we gave them in the Big Ugly Bill.2176    Instead, they have called us here to distract from the2177horrors unfolding in Trump's DHS and to focus on one county in2178Virginia that has chosen not to join the Trump Administration's2179extreme anti-immigrant agenda. They want to shine a spotlight2180on Fairfax County, one of the safest places in the country for2181a county of its size, because they think it is a good2182opportunity to engage in their favorite sport of fearmongering2183and demagoguery.2184    Mr. Descano, is there anything you have heard that you2185would like to respond to?2186    Mr. Descano. Yes. Thank you, Congressman. Just I think that2187my policies have been completely misrepresented by some people2188on the Committee and on this panel. My policies are prosecution2189policies that are meant to keep my community one of the safest2190large counties in the country.2191    Last, I'd like to really drive home the point that, when it2192comes to this Abdul Jalloh case, my policies are a red herring.2193ICE knew about this gentleman for at least eight years. The2194question of, if we would have been safer with him now here,2195yes, I wish ICE would have done its job in 2018 or 2019, when2196they had him.2197    The idea that my policies impacted many of these cases that2198are being talked about is simply a red herring and not true.2199    Mr. Nadler. Thank you. Mr. Bier, the Trump Administration2200claims that it is only going after the worst of the worst and2201targeting criminals. According to ICE's own data, the majority2202of immigrants they have detained have no criminal record. Is2203the Trump Administration really going after the worst of the2204worst?2205    Mr. Bier. No, not only do 72 percent not have a criminal2206conviction and only six percent have a violent criminal2207conviction, you look at how DHS internally is classifying its2208detainees. They have multiple threat levels, three different2209threat levels, and they actually deem 72 percent of the people,2210when they have to do it internally decide, OK, we need to2211actually rank these people and prioritize. Who do need to be2212detain? Seventy-two percent of the people entered and booked2213into ICE custody were not deemed a threat. It's according to2214their documents, their own analysis from the Department of2215Homeland Security under Secretary Noem, who put out this2216information.2217    No, they are not going after public safety threats. That's2218totally wrong. They're going after people going to work.2219They're racially profiling Americans, as I said. They're even2220arresting legal immigrants, and again, setting them up for2221arrest by not processing their applications.2222    Joseph Edlow, who is the head of USCIS, has a policy.2223They're just going to shut down processing of the vast majority2224of green cards. That results in people losing status and2225enables ICE to go out and arrest them, legal immigrants being2226arrested because the Department of Homeland Security doesn't do2227its job.2228    Mr. Nadler. Professor Stoever, do you have any recent2229examples where victims or witnesses of crimes were afraid to2230interact with law enforcement? What happened in those cases?2231    Ms. Stoever. It's incredibly common now that there's just2232an absolute fear of interacting with law enforcement, and even2233seeking civil protection orders, the civil remedies. It's not2234only a fear of increasing.2235    What ends up happening if people aren't seeking help, then,2236also, I want to add to the conversation that benefits, public2237benefits, CHIP, SNAP, have been cutoff to legal immigrants and2238those who hold the temporary status. Really, what's happening2239is that the abuse is continuing and the people's financial2240security is weakening. What we have is greater crime.2241    Mr. Nadler. Thank you. Mr. Bier, can you explain why civil2242immigration detainers are unlawful under the Fourth Amendment?2243    Mr. Bier. Well, you can't hold someone unless you have2244probable cause and a court order. This is not--2245    Mr. McClintock. Once again, the gentleman's time has2246expired. A brief response. You can pick it up on the next2247question.2248    Mr. Bier. There are multiple appeals court decisions on2249this. You cannot detain someone based on a civil detainer2250that's not based on a court order.2251    If Fairfax gets a court order, they will detain them, but2252without a judicial order, they don't have authority under the2253Constitution to detain people.2254    Mr. McClintock. Thank you.2255    Mr. Nadler. Thank you, Mr. Chair. I yield back.2256    Mr. McClintock. The gentleman doesn't have any time to2257yield back. Mr. Fry?2258    Mr. Fry. Thank you, Mr. Chair. I'm going to yield to the--2259    Mr. Nadler. I yielded it, nonetheless.2260    Mr. Fry. I'm going to yield to the Chair in a second.2261    This is actually a remarkable hearing, what I have2262witnessed today, both from the sheriff and the Commonwealth's2263Attorney. The inability, or the unwillingness to prosecute2264crimes that are committed in your jurisdiction, is almost a2265fireable offense. I hope that the good people of Virginia2266remove you from office.2267    Criminals are back out on the streets in Fairfax County2268because you want to virtue signal public safety, and you are2269making communities less safe. In fact, we have a bill called2270Logan's Law. You would be a poster child. Because I bet, if we2271stacked up your plea deals and your dropped charges against2272other real prosecutors in the country, what it would show is2273that you are actually operating like a public defender and not2274a prosecutor.2275    With that, Mr. Chair, I yield you the balance of my time.2276    Chair Jordan. I appreciate the gentleman yielding. Mr.2277Attorney General, let me ask you a few things here.2278    Well, first, in your distinguished career, Attorney2279General, and you were in the assembly before that. Before all2280that, you were a prosecutor yourself, is that right?2281    Mr. Miyares. That's correct.2282    Chair Jordan. Yes. Is it usually a good thing if the law2283enforcement people aren't getting along with the prosecutor?2284Normally, it is better if they get along and they are working2285together to keep the bad guys off the street and protect the2286community.2287    Mr. Miyares. No question, it's a cooperative arrangement.2288    Chair Jordan. Yes. In your time as a prosecutor, I doubt2289maybe you did, but I doubt it with your distinguished career2290that you ever had your chief law enforcement, in whatever2291jurisdiction you were prosecutor, I doubt if you ever had them2292say, ``It's shameful the way this prosecutor is not2293prosecuting.'' Did that ever happen to you, Mr. Attorney2294General?2295    Mr. Miyares. No, we never had what happened with the2296Fairfax Police Chief saying,22972298          What bothers me about this case is the fact that this2299        absolutely could have been prevented.23002301          Stephanie Minter should be alive right now, and she's not2302        because Steve Descano's office chose to release him back in the2303        public.23042305No, that's never happened in my career.2306    Chair Jordan. Yes, it doesn't happen in most places where2307you have a prosecutor who works with law enforcement to keep2308the bad guys off the street.2309    Now, let's get back to this policy issue that Mr. Descano2310was talking about. He says what he said to the voters when he2311was running for the job, that doesn't really count. ``I got an2312official policy. What I said to the voters, no--forget that.''2313    Frankly, that is what happens with a lot of policies. I2314actually think it should be just the opposite; whatever you2315tell the voters, if they elect you, you should do what you2316said. He is doing that. He is just trying to wiggle around it2317now.2318    Here's the policy: Consideration of, and this is ``County2319of Fairfax, Commonwealth Attorney Procedure Memorandum, 12/15/23202020,'' Policy Title: ``Guidelines for Plea Bargaining,2321Charging Decisions, and Sentencing.'' Authorizing Signature:2322Steve Descano.2323    Here's what it says on point 14, Mr. Attorney General:2324``Consideration of immigration consequences. Assistant2325Commonwealth Attorneys shall consider,'' we all know--we are in2326this business of writing laws ``may'' and ``shall'' are two2327different words. Right? ``Shall'' means you have got to look at2328this stuff.2329    He puts a little other thing ``shall consider immigration2330consequences, where possible, where doing so accords with2331justice'' all that stuff. It is not a ``may''; it is a2332``shall.''2333    That is their policy. Do you agree with that, Mr. Attorney2334General?2335    Mr. Miyares. That is their policy, yes, Mr. Chair.2336    Chair Jordan. Do you believe that has impacted the decision2337to let these bad guys on the street who did terrible things?2338Again, Ms. Minter is beside you. Her daughter--2339    Mr. Miyares. Just between 2022-2024, Mr. Descano dropped2340the charges on Mr. Jalloh of trespassing, malicious wounding,2341theft, petty larceny, trespassing, disorderly conduct, and2342malicious wounding.2343    Chair Jordan. That is like seven crimes, right?2344    Mr. Miyares. Correct.2345    Chair Jordan. Now, here's what I want to know. Maybe your2346office, Mr. Descano, is willing to give us this information2347because you said, ``Oh, no, immigration status'' my last time,2348you said immigration status had no determination on the2349decision relative to Mr. Morales-Ortez.2350    I want to know in cases where it did, what were the cases2351where you changed the plea agreement or you changed the2352charging decision that were based on consideration of their2353immigration status?2354    If you say this doesn't matter anymore; ``We took it down2355off the website. I didn't really believe what I told the2356voters,'' if that is the case, I want to know, did you ever use2357immigration status as a reason to impact the sentence and the2358charging decision or plea agreement?2359    Mr. Descano. Well, sir--2360    Chair Jordan. Can you get us that information? That's what2361I'm asking. Just give us that information. I want to know what2362are the cases where we took into account this individual's2363immigration status and we changed the charging decision. Can2364you give us those cases?2365    Mr. Descano. Sir, I don't have those cases with me.2366    Chair Jordan. Well imagine that--2367    Mr. Descano. I'd love to talk to you about the policy2368because I think it's been--2369    Chair Jordan. You don't have those cases with you? Is it a2370significant number?2371    Mr. Descano. Well, sir, if I may dig into the policy, I2372think it will be illustrious.2373    Chair Jordan. No, I asked you about the cases. I want to2374know the number of times you look into there, because here's2375what everyone sees. You are trying to say it is not the case.2376Everyone sees you have got an American citizen who does a2377crime. You have got an illegal immigrant who does the exact2378same crime. Your policy strong it seems to me says that this2379person will get a different sentence or a different plea2380agreement than the American citizen.2381    Mr. Descano. It absolutely--2382    Chair Jordan. I want to know if that ever happened.2383    Mr. Descano. It absolutely says in the policy in black and2384white that an immigrant will not get a better outcome than a2385U.S. citizen. That is in the policy. That's later. You read2386one-half sentence, sir. This is a two-paragraph policy.2387    Chair Jordan. Well, here's what again, let's go back to the2388website you took down.2389    Mr. McClintock. I'm sorry. I'm sorry, Mr. Chair, the2390gentleman's time has expired.2391    Chair Jordan. I thank the gentleman. I yield.2392    Mr. McClintock. Mr. Tiffany?2393    Mr. Tiffany. Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.2394    I want to thank Ms. Minter for the verse that she read at2395the end of her testimony. It was moving and thank you so much2396for that. Thank you so much for sharing the memories of your2397daughter with us with those pictures. I'm just sorry that there2398are not going to be more pictures for us to be able to see in2399the future. Wishing you the very best.2400    In Wisconsin Mr. Miyares, I have got a question for you at2401the end of a couple of sentences here. In Wisconsin, we had a2402terrible situation. It sounds like it is like Fairfax. In Dane2403County, which is Madison, Wisconsin, they have the same thing.2404They have sanctuary policies.2405    An illegal Venezuelan immigrant, known gang member, was let2406free, and then, later arrested. He was later arrested over 1002407miles away in the town of Prairie du Chien in Wisconsin. He was2408charged with domestic violence, sexual assault, child abuse,2409and strangulation.2410    Doesn't this make it very clear that these sanctuary2411policies they affect all of us, whether it is in our State, our2412region, whatever. About all the people that come from our great2413State of Wisconsin that visit Washington, DC. It seems to me2414that Fairfax County not very far away that this could be a2415problem for people who live all over the country, just like2416this example where Madison, Dane County, Wisconsin, refused to2417remove someone who went on to strangle someone. Isn't this a2418really big problem that is being created that does not just2419affect places like Dane County, Wisconsin, and Fairfax County,2420Virginia?2421    Mr. Miyares. It is a massive problem, Congressman. If you2422meet with victims, as I have through the years, the one thing a2423victim will tell you they want--they do not want to become is2424just a number, just a statistic.2425    It has been cited, some of the Fairfax public safety2426numbers, but at the end of the day, every victim their life is2427changed from the date of the offense, when they have lost their2428loved one. It absolutely affects.2429    What's amazing about this is that, in counties where you2430actually have say Bedford County in Virginia with Sheriff2431Miller, a great sheriff, and Wes Nance, a great Commonwealth's2432Attorney; they don't get these headlines. They don't get these2433headlines because they actually cooperate with Federal2434immigration authorities.2435    What happens in Fairfax is they're making a conscious2436decision, and you're seeing it over and over again. It's not2437just a failure to cooperate with Federal immigration2438authorities. It is a conscious decision by Steve Descano to2439under-prosecute crimes over and over again.2440    People, I pointed out what happened when a judge told ICE2441that they had to release him because they were not allowed to2442deport him to Sierra Leone. The reality is this was so2443preventable, because multiple times he was arrested multiple2444times. This prosecutor had the policy of under-prosecuting and2445dropping charge. It's not just this case. It's multiple cases.2446He has made a conscious decision.2447    I'm a little incredulous he has decided to say: Well, the2448promises I made to the campaign, when I was campaigning voters,2449they don't really count.2450    I'm a firm believer, let your ``yes'' be yes; your ``no''2451be no. It's not what you say; it's what you do.2452    He may claim this has no impact on his charging decisions,2453but if you look at time and time again and I can go through the2454cases, and so can Mr. Kennedy there is a volume of cases where2455he has made a conscious decision to under-prosecute and,2456essentially, treat illegal immigrants with greater deference2457than he would an American citizen who is charged with a crime.2458    Mr. Tiffany. Is there a correlation with the crime2459statistics being done? I was looking at some yesterday that2460came out of the Judiciary Committee where it was 67 of the2461largest municipalities here in America, the decrease in a year2462was, like, 236 fewer murders in the United States. Think about2463it: Compared to the previous year, there is a reduction that2464there's 236 more people that are alive in America as a result2465of this. Is there a correlation with this securing our border2466and those places that choose to be tough on crime? Do you think2467there's a correlation?2468    Mr. Miyares. No question. Because I do think sanctuary2469policies also create a magnet for groups. If you look at, say,2470Fairfax County, it's estimated, roughly, 200,000 illegal aliens2471are in Fairfax. If you look right next door to Loudoun, it's2472about 25,000. Why? MS-13 and TD and other transnational gangs2473understand that they are in a sanctuary, that they can operate2474with impunity. They, then, reside in Fairfax, and oftentimes,2475are committing their crimes all over2476    Mr. Tiffany. Fairfax and Dane County, Wisconsin, they are2477actually magnets for for violent illegal aliens?2478    Mr. Miyares. Correct. They know they can go there, and if2479they're picked up on a charge, they know they have local2480government in this case, the Fairfax Board of Supervisors has2481passed the Trust Policy, which is an explicit prohibition on2482cooperation. They know this; they're not dumb. They know which2483localities open the doors to them and which localities2484cooperate with Federal authorities.2485    Mr. McClintock. The gentleman's time has expired.2486    Mr. Tiffany. Thank you, Mr. Chair.2487    Mr. McClintock. Mr. Knott?2488    Mr. Knott. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Ms. Minter, I'm so sorry.2489This is, clearly, a preventable crime, despite what has been2490said. As the father of two daughters, I can't imagine what2491you're going through, what you will go through. Candidly, I2492would not be acting as civilly with some of the people you are2493seated with, had I suffered what you have had to endure. Thank2494you for being here.2495    Mr. Descano, you said that, quote, ``We prosecute Virginia2496cases.'' Is that correct?2497    Mr. Descano. That is correct, yes.2498    Mr. Knott. You painted a picture of being rigorous in your2499efforts to prosecute bad people. Correct?2500    Mr. Descano. Yes. When we prosecute, of course, we take a2501look at every case.2502    Mr. Knott. Yes.2503    Mr. Descano. We are constrained by the evidence.2504    Mr. Knott. Yes.2505    Mr. Descano. We are constrained by the law. I will tell2506you, Congressman, what is happening here with the number of2507cases that we're talking about are there's so much.2508    Mr. Knott. I want to talk to you about one of those cases.2509I want to talk to you about one of those cases, sir.2510    Mr. Descano. Sir--2511    Mr. Knott. Mr. Hyrum Rodriguez. Do you remember that case?2512    Mr. Descano. I do.2513    Mr. Knott. Leading up to the crime that I want to talk2514about, the defendant's criminal history included multiple2515charges and arrests for indecent liberties, exposing himself to2516a child, exposing himself to a child less than 15 years of age,2517disorderly conduct, illegally entering a property to damage,2518burglary. He was even sentenced albeit, I would say, too2519lightly while he was on probation, while he was under court2520supervision.2521    On June 15, 2023, at four o'clock in the morning, Fairfax2522County PD responded to a burglary in process. A mother and her2523four-year-old daughter were asleep in the same room, but in2524separate beds. The mother was awoken when her four-year-old2525daughter was screaming in the next room. She went to2526investigate. The attacker dropped the four-year-old and fled2527the scene. It was clear that the four-year-old had been2528abducted from her bed. Her buttocks had been grabbed. Her torso2529had been bruised. The victim displayed immediate bruising. The2530mother did not see the attacker's face, but the four-year-old2531said he was a, quote, ``big man.''2532    Law enforcement identified Mr. Rodriguez in two ways.2533First, Forensics recovered a finger and palm print from the2534window that he jarred open in this case and matched footprints2535outside the house where he was standing with a mud print inside2536the house.2537    Second, Eyewitness testimony later identified Rodriguez as2538having been loitering for days outside this apartment building.2539He had been seen using drugs in the neighborhood, and he had2540been pacing around this particular unit in the days leading up2541to the crime.2542    Police secured two warrants. First, statutory burglary,2543specifically alleging that Rodriguez entered an occupied2544dwelling, seizing a four-year-old with the intent to commit2545murder, rape, robbery, or arson. The maximum penalty is 202546years. Second, abduction of a four-year-old with the intent to2547defile such person was the second charge, with a maximum2548penalty of life.2549    Once it was handed over to your office, inexplicably so,2550you immediately reduced the burglary offense to a misdemeanor,2551which capped the sentence at 12 months. You then reduced the2552abduction charge to an offense that was a lower degree and2553capped the sentence at 10 years.2554    When you entered into a plea agreement, you tried to bind2555the court, they could not sentence this person to any term over2556two years. Is that not correct?2557    Mr. Descano. Sir, I'm so glad you brought this case up2558because--2559    Mr. Knott. Is that not correct?2560    Mr. Descano. Well, because I would like to explain, sir.2561    Mr. Knott. It is correct. The court rejected it.2562    Mr. Descano. Sir, I know the case file--2563    Mr. Knott. This was a--2564    Mr. Descano. I would love to talk to you about--2565    Mr. Knott. I'm talking. It was a judge that was appointed2566by Senator Warner.2567    Mr. Descano. You are assuming--Sir--2568    Mr. Knott. This is not a Right-wing judge. This is a2569liberal judge. Do you know why he rejected it?2570    Mr. Descano. Sir, I would love to talk about the case--2571    Mr. Knott. He saw what you should have seen. He cited2572overwhelming evidence--2573    Mr. Descano. Can we talk about the evidence, sir?2574    Mr. Knott. --that this person was a threat--2575    Mr. Descano. Because I know it and you don't.2576    Mr. Knott. Quit talking.2577    Mr. Descano. I would love to tell you about it.2578    Mr. Knott. This person was a threat. He yanked a four-year-2579old girl out of her bed with the intent to harm her. You wanted2580to give him a cap of two years.2581    Mr. Descano. Sir, this is a great example--2582    Mr. Knott. Then, when the plea agreement was rejected, what2583did you do?2584    Mr. Descano. Sir, this is a great example--2585    Mr. Knott. What did you do?2586    Mr. Descano. This is a great example of a case where--2587    Mr. Knott. I have prosecuted--I have prosecuted cases--2588    Mr. Descano. Then, you understand cases that don't have2589strong evidence--2590    Mr. Knott. When you're evading like that, do you know what2591that's a sign of? Guilt. What did you do? You dismissed the2592case.2593    Mr. Descano. Sir, can I please talk to you--2594    Mr. Knott. Mr. Descano, when you dismiss be quiet--2595    Mr. Descano. --about this case, if you want to know about2596it so much?2597    Mr. Knott. When you dismiss a case, what happens to that2598defendant?2599    Mr. Miyares. He walks free.2600    Mr. Knott. He walks free. A disgusting, perverted2601individual preying on children, that you dismissed the case. As2602the father of two young girls one of them is five that is as2603shameful as anything I have seen.2604    Mr. Descano. I have a daughter, too, sir.2605    Mr. Knott. Quit defending the indefensible.2606    Mr. Descano. Don't--please don't talk to me, that I don't2607care about people in my community.2608    Mr. Knott. You, clearly, don't.2609    Mr. Descano. Absolutely not.2610    Mr. Knott. You dismissed the case, and it's shameful.2611You're a coward. You are a coward.2612    Mr. Descano. Sir, you won't even let me talk to you about2613the case, sir.2614    Mr. Knott. It's indefensible, sir. I yield back.2615    Mr. McClintock. Mr. Gill?2616    Mr. Gill. Thank you, Mr. Chair, for holding this hearing on2617a really important issue that a lot of Americans care very2618deeply about.2619    Mr. Descano, I want to start with you. I have got a couple2620of questions for you.2621    I have got a document titled, ``Guidelines for Plea2622Bargaining, Charging Decisions, and Sentencing.'' It states2623that,26242625        Prosecutors shall consider the collateral immigration2626        consequences of the specific crimes the defendant is charged2627        with and the detrimental impact that the deportation/removal2628        has on the families and communities [that] those removed will2629        leave behind.26302631    This document is your official policy. This is not from2632your campaign website. This is the official policy document as2633well. Is that correct? Do you recognize this?2634    Mr. Descano. Yes. You read a portion of the policy, sir.2635    Mr. Gill. That's right. I'm not going to read the full2636thing since it's quite long.2637    Mr. Descano. Oh, I don't expect you to, sir.2638    Mr. Gill. It's about 11 pages. It's about 11 pages. I'm not2639going to read the full thing.2640    I want to better understand how you weigh an illegal2641alien's immigration status whenever you are making charging2642decisions. Do you know who Ander Jose Cortez-Mendez is? Are you2643familiar with that case?2644    Mr. Descano. Yes, sir.2645    Mr. Gill. OK. This is a Guatemalan illegal alien who was2646arrested in March 2024. He was initially charged with, quote,2647``carnal knowledge'' of a 13-14-year-old.2648    Just for those of us who aren't lawyers, can you describe2649just very briefly what does ``carnal knowledge'' of a 13-14-2650year-old mean in this context?2651    Mr. Descano. Well, sir, generally, a charge like that2652would, typically, refer to underage sex.2653    Mr. Gill. OK. He raped an underage person. An illegal alien2654who raped an underage American. Your office reduced those2655charges to a misdemeanor charge of consensual sex with a child265615 years and older. You offered him a 90-day suspended jail2657sentence, is that correct?2658    Mr. Descano. Sir, based on the evidence that we had in the2659case--2660    Mr. Gill. It is correct?2661    Mr. Descano. It's not related to the policy, sir.2662    Mr. Gill. That is correct? I just want to ask you, whenever2663you were making that charging decision to reduce the charge,2664how did you weigh the defendant's immigration status?2665    Mr. Descano. Well, sir, I'll to be clear, I was not the2666lead prosecutor in that case.2667    Mr. Gill. It was your office.2668    Mr. Descano. Oh, absolutely, sir. I, of course, rely on my2669team of 50-some attorneys to do cases.2670    Mr. Gill. Sure.2671    Mr. Descano. What is important is that, oftentimes, as you2672know, sir, as a prosecutor, we're constrained by the evidence.2673We are constrained by--2674    Mr. Gill. I just need to know, how did you take into2675account the defendant's immigration status in making that2676decision?2677    Mr. Descano. Well, sir, again, I'm saying--2678    Mr. Gill. How did your office make that determination?2679    Mr. Descano. I you're, you're--well, what I would say is2680that--and thank you for clarifying for you to take a look at2681the immigration consequences policy, or when you see--2682    Mr. Gill. Let me ask it a different way. Did your office2683reduce charges against this illegal alien from a felony rape2684charge to a misdemeanor charge with a 90-day suspended jail2685sentence, in part, because this was an illegal alien in2686question?2687    Mr. Descano. No, this was evidentiary-based.2688    Mr. Gill. It was evidence there was no it had nothing to do2689with the defendant's immigration status?2690    Mr. Descano. Sir, when--2691    Mr. Gill. Is that your testimony?2692    Mr. Descano. If you read the policy, you'll see that it2693explicitly carves out--2694    Mr. Gill. Did it have anything to do with the defendant's2695immigration status? It's just yes or no.2696    Mr. Descano. Well, sir, it was based on the evidence.2697    Mr. Gill. I'm asking you, was their immigration status part2698of the evidence? It's a yes or no.2699    Mr. Descano. I don't believe so.2700    Mr. Gill. You don't believe so? Your policy says that you2701``shall consider'' the immigration status.2702    Mr. Descano. Actually, sir, if you actually read the whole2703policy, it explicitly carves out cases--2704    Mr. Gill. Quote,27052706        Prosecutors shall consider the collateral immigration2707        consequences of the specific crime(s) the defendant is charged2708        with and the detrimental impact that deportation/removal has on2709        the families.27102711    Mr. Descano. It also mentions that--2712    Mr. Gill. Line for line--2713    Mr. Descano. --it's not outcome-determinative. It also2714explicitly states--2715    Mr. Gill. I understand, and I'm asking you if you weighed,2716your office weighed, the defendant's immigration status in2717making your charging decisions here.2718    Mr. Descano. Oh, again, sir, I was not, the lead2719prosecutor--2720    Mr. Gill. I'm asking about your office. I understand you're2721not the lead prosecutor.2722    Mr. Descano. Exactly. I just want to be clear. The way that2723the policy is written that case should not have fallen under2724the rubric of this policy. This is a narrow policy, and it's2725meant to be a narrow policy.2726    Mr. Gill. He is an illegal alien. I think that would2727qualify, would it not?2728    Mr. Descano. Well, no, sir, because, again, the way that2729the policy is being presented as, it is as it is outcome-2730determinative, goes to every case.2731    Mr. Gill. There would be immigration consequences based on2732what charge you bring. That would clearly apply to this case.2733    Mr. Descano. No, sir. Again, that's the reason why I2734mentioned earlier you read a portion, but not the entire two2735paragraphs of this subheading.2736    Mr. Gill. ``Prosecutors shall consider.'' I just want to2737know, just give me a yes-or-no answer. Did you take into2738account the defendant's immigration status?2739    Mr. Descano. Sir, again, I was not but the way the policy--2740    Mr. Gill. Did your office take into--2741    Mr. Descano. The way the policy is written--2742    Mr. Gill. It's a yes-or-no question.2743    Mr. Descano. No, they should not have taken--2744    Mr. Gill. They should not have taken?2745    Mr. Descano. That's not outcome-determinative in a case2746like this, sir.2747    Mr. Gill. Great. Thank you. My time is up.2748    Mr. McClintock. Mr. Grothman?2749    Mr. Grothman. Yes, I had another hearing. I apologize if2750I'm asking a question that has already been asked.2751    Obviously, we have immigration laws in this country. Every2752country has immigration laws. We have 800,000 people, about,2753naturalized in this country every year. We are right now in a2754position in which one out of six Americans in this country are2755foreign-born, one out of six people in this country, which is2756the all-time high. Nobody could say that, under current law, we2757are not more than generous with people who want to come here.2758    Nevertheless, there's some people who I can only--unless2759they are very foolish, they are trying to destroy the country2760by, in addition to the 800,000 people getting sworn in, want to2761let unlimited other people in the country.2762    Now, my first question is for Sheriff Kincaid. I hear from2763my local sheriffs in Wisconsin, if there's any activity from2764Federal agents--FBI, ATF, DEA, U.S. Marshals, and Secret2765Service, they always contact, the Federal agency or they call2766them, to coordinate with them. Maybe setting up a perimeter, or2767maybe if they have to remove somebody, take them to the local2768jail.2769    We are told and that would seem to be automatic as an2770American. Nevertheless, we are told, Sheriff Kincaid, that your2771office sometimes is reluctant to assist Federal agencies in2772ongoing investigations intended to safeguard citizens. How do2773you respond to that charge?2774    Sheriff Kincaid. First and foremost, we never obstruct ICE.2775As a matter of fact, we work with them in three or four more2776ways. When they request or call and ask for assistance,2777especially when it comes to turning someone over, we coordinate2778that with them to ensure their safety. As far as not2779cooperating with them, we do. We do that all the time, just2780like any other law enforcement agency.2781    Mr. Grothman. OK. Does Virginia law explicitly authorize2782compliance with ICE detainers within five days of a criminal2783alien's release from your custody?2784    Sheriff Kincaid. Based on the judicial or the2785administrative warrant, there is law that allows for us to turn2786an individual over to ICE five times prior to when they are set2787to be released.2788    Mr. Grothman. Do you?2789    Sheriff Kincaid. ICE does know that.2790    Mr. Grothman. Yes, and you--2791    Sheriff Kincaid. We do.2792    Mr. Grothman. You do? OK. Has your office conducted an2793audit of what happens to individuals you have released instead2794of honoring ICE detainers, or do you always honor the2795detainers?2796    Sheriff Kincaid. In terms, we honor detainers. It is when2797we are presented with a judicial warrant that we will continue2798to detain somebody because it's authorized by a judge.2799    Mr. Grothman. OK. Mr. Miyares, can you give a high-level2800overview of the findings of your September 2025, investigation2801into Fairfax County's the Fairfax County Commonwealth's2802Attorney's Office?2803    Mr. Miyares. Yes, sir. We conducted one and saw that, in2804our opinion, Mr. Descano views himself more as a social worker2805than a prosecutor. That as a result, he has systematic failed2806the victims in Fairfax County. We talk to so many, not just2807those and including victims that were immigrants, but everyday2808citizens that have felt that the Fairfax County Commonwealth's2809Attorney's Office had failed them.2810    Mr. Grothman. OK. Could you respond, or do you agree with2811everything Sheriff Kincaid has told you?2812    Mr. Miyares. I do find it curious, what we have is they2813keep trying to say they need a judicial warrant. As you know,2814DHS and others said that is not required in this case.2815    What you've seen, actually, in Virginia, disturbingly, is2816that we just had our current Governor pass an Executive Order,2817her first one, EO 1, that banned cooperation with Federal2818immigration authorities, not just with the State police,2819overturning Governor Youngkin's policies, but also the2820Department of Corrections. In other words, someone that is a2821convicted felon in a Virginia prison, even then. You are seeing2822a lot of bad policies from Fairfax being brought statewide.2823    Mr. Grothman. OK. That's kind of shocking. I guess, if you2824would elaborate on it a little bit, and what would happen in2825this country if--or what effect that has on people who are here2826illegally and are illegally committing crimes?2827    Mr. Miyares. We, as a Nation, allow, roughly, one-million2828legal immigrants a year. We are a good, decent, and generous2829people. That's who we are. I'm the child of an immigrant.2830    What Americans do not like is be seen that they're being2831taken advantage of. During the Biden Administration, between 8-283210 million illegal immigrants came into this country. That is2833larger than the population of 32 U.S. States. That is not2834tenable. People are not doing it the right way.2835    There is not a country on the planet that is as generous2836with legal immigration as we are. It's not even close. What we2837don't appreciate right now are people that are cutting in line2838and breaking our laws. It's something we all learned in grade2839school. We have too many policymakers who decided that's OK and2840they shrug their shoulders. They turned a blind eye.2841    In this case, Steve Descano deciding to adopt policies,2842taking someone's illegal immigration status and under-2843prosecuting cases, in which we're seeing the tragic results, as2844we're seeing today.2845    Mr. McClintock. The gentleman's time has expired. Ms.2846Scanlon?2847    Ms. Scanlon. Thank you, Mr. Chair. I practiced alongside2848immigration attorneys for a period of time before coming to2849Congress, so have a sense of just how broken our immigration2850system is and how hard it is, even for people who are trying to2851follow the rules, to actually follow the rules. A lot of the2852conversation we have in Congress seems to come from folks who2853don't understand how the system is actually working, or not2854working.2855    If our Republican colleagues want to talk about who and2856what is making Americans less safe today, it is this White2857House and its chaos and its reckless mass deportation agenda.2858Families and communities are being torn apart. Citizens have2859been ripped from their homes with no warrants in cases of2860mistaken identity. Federal agents have shot and killed2861Americans in our streets for daring to question their unlawful2862tactics.2863    The White House has prioritized meeting deportation quotas,2864and in doing so, has targeted all immigrants, including those2865who have followed our rules and who, until this administration2866changed the rules, those folks were in our country legally.2867    The majority of folks who have been detained by ICE have no2868criminal record here or in their home countries. That is2869according to the agency's own data. While ICE and CBP claim to2870be ``claim'' to be focusing on the worst of the worst, instead2871they have gone after toddlers with Spider-Man backpacks,2872parents taking their kids to school or to the hospital for2873cancer treatment, hardworking people showing up at work,2874spouses of military veterans and active duty service members,2875and law-abiding people who are showing up for their interviews2876and court hearings, as they are following the rules to do what2877they need to do to become citizens or obtain other forms of2878legal status.2879    Who does any of this make more safe? Aside from the trauma2880and the heartbreak that these policies have inflicted on2881individual families and communities, the damage to our economy2882is mounting by the day.2883    That damage comes from companies rethinking their2884investments in the United States, because they see their2885citizens, their folks, getting abused by our immigration2886agents.2887    Tourists who have decided not to visit Disney World or2888celebrate our 250th Anniversary or attend the World Cup this2889year. We have seen bookings from overseas are down 20-302890percent across the country, but we are particularly sensitive2891to it in Philadelphia.2892    We are seeing physicians, researchers, and students from2893around the world who have been deterred from bringing their2894talents and what they can bring to our country by additional2895visa fees, and by the risks of being targeted by misguided2896immigration agents.2897    Throughout our country's history, immigrants have been2898drawn here by the promise of America and its brighter future.2899They bring meaningful contributions to our economy, our2900culture, our social fabric in all our communities.2901    We should be fixing our outdated, broken immigration system2902to make it better and more efficient, not undermining it or2903just trying to gut it entirely. Because failing to do that work2904is a huge disservice to all us and to the future success of our2905Nation.2906    Our Republican colleagues have tried to say this is about2907fighting crime, but in pursuit of this Administration's2908indiscriminate crackdown, they are diverting Federal law2909enforcement, prosecutors, and resources away from serious2910threats, including child exploitation, fentanyl trafficking,2911and domestic terrorism.2912    This is really misguided. It seems to be entirely about2913politics and not about actual safety.2914    Mr. Descano, in the few seconds we have left, is there2915anything you would like to add? Because you seem like you have2916been a very practical and engaged public servant.2917    Mr. Descano. Well, thank you, Congresswoman, and there are2918a few things I would love to add.2919    First, let me be clear. My policy that we're talking about2920was written with legal permanent residents in mind for minor2921crimes. It was based off the Padilla v. Kentucky U.S. Supreme2922Court case that said it is a good idea for prosecutors and2923defense attorneys to take into account and to know collateral2924immigration consequences.2925    The other thing I'd like to say is, Mr. Miyares and Mr.2926Kennedy, they've never been to my office. They've never seen2927the case files that I've seen. They jump to a bunch of2928conclusions--2929    [Mr. McClintock gavels for order.]2930    Mr. McClintock. The gentleman's time has expired. I will2931let you finish that sentence.2932    Mr. Descano. Thank you, sir. They jump to conclusions about2933case outcomes that we may not be thrilled about and give them2934and ascribe reasons that simply aren't the reasons.2935    Mr. McClintock. Thank you. Mr. Onder?2936    Ms. Scanlon. Thank you.2937    Mr. Onder. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Descano, in your2938written testimony, you wrote, ``The system failed Ms. Minter.''2939Do you consider yourself part of that failure?2940    Mr. Descano. Sir, I do believe that the entire system did2941fail. I will tell you that I wish that there were things that2942we could have done and had the things to go forward--with on2943some of those cases.2944    Mr. Onder. OK. You said that. OK. Did the police fail Ms.2945Minter?2946    Mr. Descano. No, sir. I think what the--2947    Mr. Onder. Did Sheriff Kincaid fail Ms. Minter?2948    Mr. Descano. No, sir, but I think that--2949    Mr. Onder. Everyone failed Ms. Minter. The system failed2950the amorphous system, not you; you, a soft-on-crime Soros2951prosecutor; not you who does not honor ICE detainers. Neither2952of you believe in honoring ICE civil detainers, no judicial2953detainers that in most cases are not even possible to obtain.2954    Ms. Minter, do you feel the system failed you and your2955daughter Stephanie?2956    Ms. Minter. [Ms. Minter nods her head in the affirmative.]2957    Mr. Onder. Yes. Do you feel, Ms. Minter, that you can opine2958or not, if you don't do you feel that Mr. Descano's2959prosecutor's officer hears victims?2960    Ms. Minter. Hears victims?2961    Mr. Onder. Takes victims into account, and potential2962victims?2963    Ms. Minter. No.2964    Mr. Onder. Because, based on the policies of Fairfax2965County, both the sheriff's office and the prosecutor's office,2966what happened to you and your family was entirely preventable.2967    Ms. Minter. I believe it was.2968    Mr. Onder. Yes. When you have the policy of not cooperating2969with ICE by the way, in violation of Federal law these things2970are going to happen. People who should not have been in the2971United States of America at all, criminal illegal aliens, in2972our solicitousness, to appease the radical Left base of the2973Democrat Party and their open borders policies, it is a policy2974we don't want to deport anyone.2975    Mr. Descano even said it on his campaign website. ``Well,2976that's not really the policy of the Fairfax County's County2977Prosecutor's Office.'' OK. Were you lying to the voters or are2978you lying to us now today?2979    Ms. Minter. What I believe is that these vicious criminals,2980the criminals that keep hurting our people should not be out of2981here. They need to be deported. You know what? I don't think it2982has to do with ICE--2983    Mr. Onder. Right.2984    Ms. Minter. It has to do with having--we're nowhere. We're2985not a country without illegals coming in--2986    Mr. Onder. Without--2987    Ms. Minter. --and without people coming in from other2988countries. That's what our country is built on.2989    Mr. Onder. There is no such thing as a sovereign Nation2990without secure borders. Well, thank you. No, thank you, and2991thank you for your courage being here today.2992    Yes, it is nice to give lip service, ``Oh, the system2993failed you, Ms. Minter.'' It is another thing to do something2994about it, especially when the radical base of your party2995doesn't want you to do anything about it. We know that two2996elected officials to your Left today, we know where they sided.2997Did they side with victims, or did they side with their radical2998left, open borders base? We know the answer to that.2999    Mr. Bier, you implied in that somehow, because the United3000States is so dysfunctional regarding legal immigration, that3001this somehow encourages illegal immigration. In some way, I may3002believe that.3003    I want to give you some numbers. In 2024, the United States3004admitted it gave 1.36 million to foreign nationals green cards;3005226,000 family sponsored visas; 150,000 employment-based visas;3006and 52,000 diversity legal lottery visas. In early 2026, there3007was an asylum backlog of 3.5 million cases. Mid-2025, temporary3008protected status backlog, 1.2 million cases.3009    Mr. Miyares said--and I think I got this right, ``there's3010no country on this planet that's more generous to legal3011immigrants than the United States of America.''3012    If the numbers I read to you, Mr. Bier, are not enough,3013what is the right number? Because, roughly a billion people on3014this planet live on $2 or less per day, and I imagine quite a3015few of them would like to immigrate to the United States. What3016is that number? Is there a number? Should all the billion be3017able to immigrate into the United States legally or illegally?3018    Mr. Bier. Well, the United States ranks in the bottom3019third--3020    Mr. McClintock. The gentleman's time has expired. Mr. Bier,3021I will give you a few seconds to respond.3022    Mr. Bier. The United States ranks at the bottom third of3023wealthy countries for its foreign-born share of the population,3024for the rate at which it admits people. We're a very large3025country, and we have 338 million in here.3026    Mr. Onder. So, the goal is--3027    Mr. Bier. One million people is a third of a percent of the3028population. That's half of what it was in the early 20th3029century, and we survived that and thrived as a result of it.3030    Yes, we can allow more legal immigration to the United3031States. We should have processes that are fair, that allow3032people an opportunity to come, and protect our rights as3033Americans to associate and contract trade with the people born3034in other countries.3035    Mr. McClintock. Mr. Bier, you--3036    Mr. Onder. Thank you, Mr. Chair.3037    Mr. McClintock. Thank you. The gentleman's time has3038expired.3039    Mr. Onder. I yield back my negative time.3040    Mr. McClintock. The gentleman's time has expired. Now, I3041will recognize myself for five minutes.3042    Oh, we have got a unanimous consent request. Ms. Jayapal?3043    Ms. Jayapal. Thank you, Mr. Chair. I seek unanimous consent3044to enter into the record an opinion piece from our Seattle City3045Attorney entitled, ``Seattle's Welcoming City Policies Keep Us3046Safe.''3047    Mr. McClintock. Without objection. I will now recognize3048myself for five minutes.3049    Mr. Descano, in the case of Mr. Rodriguez whose charges you3050dropped, in the case of the four-year-old who was attacked in3051her own bedroom, I understand he was later taken into custody3052by ICE and deported. I'm just curious, did you notify ICE of3053that release, so that they could deport him? Was it the little3054girl's mother who had to call ICE to get him out of your3055community?3056    Mr. Descano. Sir, we did not call ICE.3057    Mr. McClintock. The mother had to call ICE to get him out3058of your community.3059    Mr. Miyares, we keep hearing from Sheriff Kincaid, among3060others, that they would be happy to respond to a Federal3061judicial warrant to honor a detainer request. Well, is a3062Federal judicial warrant possible to obtain in a State crime?3063    Mr. Miyares. No, it's not, and they know this.3064    Mr. McClintock. If deportation is a civil matter, how does3065one get a Federal judicial warrant?3066    Mr. Miyares. You can't. Again, they know this.3067    Mr. McClintock. They're basically lying to the public? They3068are counting on the public not understanding that what they are3069asking for is legally impossible?3070    Mr. Miyares. It's legally impossible, yes, Mr. Chair.3071    Mr. McClintock. Mr. Kennedy, do you find it odd that the3072Democrats are blaming ICE for not deporting this particular3073suspect who is accused of murdering of Stephanie Minter? Yet,3074at the same time, they refuse to notify ICE, so they can deport3075such suspects, and they refuse to fund ICE, so that they can3076deport such suspects.3077    Mr. Kennedy. I do find it odd, but I'm actually going to3078extend agreement to the Democratic side, because I believe that3079Mr. Jalloh should never have been deported whatsoever. He3080should have spent the rest of his natural life, before3081Stephanie Minter's death, in the Virginia Department of3082Corrections. Short of that, he should have been deported to3083Sierra Leone after he served his sentence.3084    None of that came about. He was never sent to prison. Mr.3085Descano said that he obtained a sentence for him for multiple3086years. He never left Fairfax County. He was never sentenced to3087prison. He spent time in jail and was released because of good3088time credits. Mr. Jalloh should have spent the rest of his life3089in prison, then, been deported.3090    Mr. McClintock. Understood. I actually have to go on. We3091keep hearing these sanctuary policies enhance public safety.3092What have your studies shown?3093    Mr. Kennedy. That these aren't the same thing. Every single3094person who is injured or is the victim of a property crime, a3095person crime, let alone a homicide, it was a completely3096preventable homicide. It was a completely preventable crime.3097These are all excess things that didn't have to happen.3098    When it comes to repeat offenders, I identify in my3099testimony 25 incidents--25 and half of them are unknown to the3100rest of the public--3101    Mr. McClintock. That is including--3102    Mr. Kennedy. --where escalating violence occurred3103escalating violence.3104    Mr. McClintock. That is including three out of seven3105homicides in Fairfax County.3106    The Center for Immigration Studies looked at the SCAAP3107documentation from States seeking reimbursement for illegal3108aliens held in their State prisons. They found that illegal3109aliens are, typically, at least three times as likely to be3110incarcerated than citizens or lawfully present aliens.3111    Mr. Miyares, the Democrats say this is all necessary to get3112illegal immigrants to report crimes. In fact, if an alien is3113the witness to or a victim of a crime, don't they qualify for a3114U visa to remain in this country under current law?3115    Mr. Miyares. Well, I don't think it builds community trust,3116either, when you see a catch-and-release program being3117instituted by this Commonwealth's Attorney's Office. That does3118not build trust for you to come forward to testify.3119    Mr. McClintock. Someone is not going to report a crime if3120they know that criminal is going to be back on the streets3121later that afternoon to take vengeance. Is that correct?3122    Mr. Miyares. That is correct. What you've seen is a3123revolving door. Every policy Mr. Descano advocates for,3124policies he's supported in the general assembly, is to allow a3125revolving door. Changing our bond policies in Virginia, and his3126own personal policies that they have in Virginia, it is to3127release criminals back into the community time and time again.3128We know from his official policy that he takes and factors in3129their immigration status as well.3130    Mr. McClintock. Ironically, when these criminals are3131released back into the community, they tend to prey on the3132illegal immigrant community where they have come from, do they3133not?3134    Mr. Miyares. No question.3135    Mr. McClintock. We had just a case recently where a legal3136immigrant from Bangladesh had her head bashed in by an illegal3137Haitian national with a long rap sheet, who had been allowed to3138remain in this country under the TPS program.3139    You mentioned that Governor Spanberger is expected to sign3140legislation that would forbid cooperation with ICE. I assume3141that would forbid notifying ICE if and when Stephanie Minter's3142killer is released?3143    Mr. Miyares. Correct. Correct. He will be, presumably, in3144the Virginia Department of Corrections. Under a current3145Executive Order, as we've noted, there's a there's no3146requirement of a judicial warrant. They won't notify ICE.3147Despite all her public pronouncements--3148    Mr. McClintock. Ms. Minter may I just--3149    Mr. Miyares. Yes.3150    Mr. McClintock. Ms. Minter, Sheriff Kincaid said that she3151didn't have her budget to make a phone call to ICE to honor a3152detainer. Does that make you feel more safe? What is your3153response to Sheriff Kincaid?3154    Ms. Minter. I'm just going to start keeping a list and3155calling ICE myself. It might be easier.3156    Mr. McClintock. Oh, my time is expired.3157    Ms. Jayapal. Mr. Chair, I have a few more unanimous consent3158requests.3159    Mr. McClintock. Go ahead.3160    Ms. Jayapal. I ask unanimous consent to enter into the3161record the Cato Institute, Mr. Bier's policy analysis titled,3162``Immigrants Cut Victimization Rates and Boost Crime3163Reporting.''3164    Mr. McClintock. Yes, we have seen it. Without objection.3165    Ms. Jayapal. Another one titled, ``Family Says Virginia3166Domestic Violence Victim Didn't Seek Help Due to Immigration3167Fears.''3168    Another one entitled, ``She Testified about Being Raped.3169Then ICE Showed Up,'' from The Atlantic.3170    Mr. McClintock. Without objection3171    Ms. Jayapal. Thank you, Mr. Chair.3172    Mr. McClintock. If there is no further business to be3173brought before the Committee, I want to thank our witnesses for3174appearing before the Subcommittee today.3175    Without objection, all Members will have five legislative3176days to submit additional written questions for the witnesses3177or additional materials for the record.3178    Mr. McClintock. Without objection, the hearing is adjourned3179    [Whereupon, at 12:44 p.m., the Subcommittee was adjourned.]31803181    All materials submitted for the record by the Members of3182the Subcommittee on Immigration Integrity, Security, and3183Enforce-3184ment can be found at the following links: https://3185docs.house.gov/Committee/Calendar/ByEvent.aspx?EventID=119272.31863187                                 [all]